I always thought this HPMOR excerpt perfectly summed up everything that's wrong with Yudkowski

I always thought this HPMOR excerpt perfectly summed up everything that's wrong with Yudkowski (https://www.reddit.com/r/SneerClub/comments/748egf/i_always_thought_this_hpmor_excerpt_perfectly/)

posted on October 04, 2017 02:14 PM by u/sansordhinn

The.following is a meta joke, intended as a good-natured wink to the reader. It’s supposed to make you feel nice and in-groupey. It’s supposed to make you empathize with the author:

“Well, I don’t intend to hang around with anyone who hangs around with Draco Malfoy,” Ron announced coldly.

Harry shrugged. “That’s up to you. I don’t intend to let anyone say who I can and can’t hang around with.” Silently chanting, please go away, please go away…

Ron’s face went blank with surprise, like he’d actually expected that line to work. Then Ron spun about, yanked his luggage’s lead and stormed off down the platform.

“If you didn’t like him,” Draco said curiously, “why didn’t you just walk away?”

“Um… his mother helped me figure out how to get to this platform from the King’s Cross Station, so it was kind of hard to tell him to get lost. And it’s not that I hate this Ron guy,” Harry said, “I just, just…” Harry searched for words.

“Don’t see any reason for him to exist?” offered Draco.

“Pretty much.”

… and at this point I put the fanfic down, feeling nauseated, and find that I can’t pick it up again. There you have it. This is the perfect metonymy for how Yudkowski’s mind work, for that uncanny-valley sensation when reading his essays, that unmistakable intuition that something’s missing—something important. Yudkowski is an educated adult, and he can’t understand the narrative function of Ron Weasley in Harry Potter. He doesn’t get Ron. He thinks the story, he thinks Harry would be better off without him. (One wonders what he’d make of Dostoyevski or Mishima or any other mature piece of literature).

Then I think of the possibility that, when the incoming socio-environmental disasters hit, and as the previous generation gets replaced, technocrats might well find themselves with actual politico-economical power. I think of the discourse surrounding basic income, of the growing support for biological determinism and eugenics, of the orgiastic nature of the AI fantasy apocalypse/apotheosis. I think of how many people in the real world would qualify as Ron Weasleys to them.

And I shudder.

u/isaacg1 29 points at 1507789325.000000

When I read this excerpt, I didn’t interpret it as the voice of the author, but as indicative of Harry’s worst character flaw - that he doesn’t really understand friendship or cooperation. It also sets up Draco as a mean and obnoxious person. Of course, different people will read things different ways.

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u/sansordhinn 18 points at 1507791205.000000

In my opinion, what shows this to be a meta joke (and not just a characterization device) is the importance that Ron (doesn't) have in the plot itself, when contrasted with the original. Elitism is a tad stronger than not understanding friendship. It would be possible to set up a scene like the above as a criticism of elitism; but this would involve the *rest* of the plot being sympathetic to that, and working to show us the dignity and importance of all people. (Sam in *Lord of the Rings* would be one example of how this can be done.)

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u/DELETED 20 points at 1507128623.000000

[deleted]

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u/dgerard 17 points at 1507369312.000000

Was about to answer this. No, he's a *grade school* dropout. He's clearly intelligent, but he's a walking caution against the perils of autodidacticism.

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u/sansordhinn 11 points at 1508069632.000000

What I was trying to hint at is: I don't think Yudkowski has reading comprehension difficulties with *Harry Potter*. I wouldn't bet money on him reading *Naked Lunch* and getting it, but he clearly has enough fluency with the written word to follow HP. So his inability to comprehend the role that Ron plays in the story must come from something else; from a sort of gap in emotional sensitivity, real or postured.

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u/dgerard 9 points at 1508427785.000000

I honestly don't think he's ever willingly consumed a work of fiction intended for an audience older than middle school. See [this article](https://web.archive.org/web/20121115132245/http://betabeat.com/2012/07/singularity-institute-less-wrong-peter-thiel-eliezer-yudkowsky-ray-kurzweil-harry-potter-methods-of-rationality/) and his visceral revulsion at the concept of reading literary fiction.

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u/DELETED 4 points at 1507836479.000000

You don't need to go to school to get an education.

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u/DELETED 9 points at 1507897694.000000

But you need teachers to challenge your perception. Autodidacts are at risk of Engineer's Disease the way an unvaccinated kid is at risk for 19th century child mortality rates.

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u/DELETED 6 points at 1507904232.000000

I picked up a lot of maths on the internet through social osmosis. I have nerdy friends and interests, and some aspect of math may become relevant to a discussion we're having. They'll explain it to me, link me to Wikipedia pages, etc. You don't need to be in school to have a teacher. [Math StackExchange](http://math.stackexchange.com), math Discord, my friends and online resources have taught me more maths than my teachers ever did (since entering university at least). Homeschooled children outperform those that attend school on virtually every metric--there's a reason for that. What's "Engineer's disease"?

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u/DELETED 15 points at 1507916026.000000

>Homeschooled children outperform those that attend school on virtually every metric--there's a reason for that. >What's "Engineer's disease"? stay in school, kids.

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u/DELETED 4 points at 1507925205.000000

I don't get? Is "stay in school kids" Engineer's disease? Are you arguing against homeschooling?

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u/DELETED 12 points at 1508106272.000000

it's funny because you said homeschooled children are better at learning things for themselves, but didn't google the definition of engineer's disease for yourself. [this comment](https://www.reddit.com/r/changemyview/comments/59vw3d/cmv_engineers_syndrome_is_not_specific_to/d9chw62/) explains it quite well i think

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u/DELETED 7 points at 1508124561.000000

I'm not homeschooled--I'm in university--but that's not why I refused to google engineer's disease. It is very possible that how you use the term is not the common usage, and what I would see online would not have been what you meant when you used the term. I would prefer if you stated explicitly what you meant, in order to prevent future confusion.

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u/pipster818 9 points at 1508303115.000000

Asking for explicit statements and defined terms? That't not how we do things here.

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u/DELETED 6 points at 1508593131.000000

How do you do things then?

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u/pipster818 5 points at 1508620118.000000

We're supposed to sneer at anyone who does that, I think. (I'm being sarcastic here, of course. "Engineer's Disease" has tons of different definitions and it's perfectly reasonable to ask which was meant.)

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u/TheAncientGeek 5 points at 1511774906.000000

Thinking that social and political problems have straightforward solutions which everyone else is too stupid to see.

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u/ilikehillaryclinton 9 points at 1507586958.000000

I think of how many people in the real world would qualify as Ron Weasleys to them.

Oh boy, basically everyone, in Yud’s eyes

There’s a point to Draco Malfoy existing, he’s the asshole that needs to be slain, so leave him around, but get rid of all the decent normal people

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u/i_fukt_ur_mum_ 9 points at 1507254394.000000

Rationalism is just disgusting.

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u/SuperMarxBros 3 points at 1509318889.000000

I don’t intend to let anyone say who I can and can’t hang around with

Like nazis

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