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Why are Rationalists so obsessed with religion and its so called benefits even if they don't believe in it? (https://www.reddit.com/r/SneerClub/comments/a1mh7h/why_are_rationalists_so_obsessed_with_religion/)
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Any time you go on Scott’s main blog or the Culture War thread, there are people always arguing in favor of the benefits of religion. But none of them believe in it! What’s the point of being an Atheist if you just want to bring back religion anyway?

To own the libs.

If you aren’t considering how much they dislike the libs, you aren’t modelling them correctly.

  • Reflexive contrarianism
  • New Atheist backlash
  • The enormous influence of Jordan Peterson
  • The importance of religion in effective authoritarian governance, which is big in Neoreactionary thought
  • A slow and agonizing progression from Owning The Libs to actually agreeing with the right about everything
> The enormous influence of Jordan Peterson At this point all he needs to say it jump and his fans say "which bridge?".
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"Liberals are just so *annoying*, you know? I mean, who *actually* gives a shit about anyone else's happiness, right?"

It’s a form of elitism. We, the high-IQ decouplers calmly reasoning out from first principles, might be able to handle the lack of a divine moral authority, but without religion to tranquilize them, the masses will destroy civilization with hypergamy or socialism or some other bête noire of choice.

I liked it better when it was called the "noble lie."
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Dude I need to play this game solely for that haha
John Stuart Mill’s father told him, “There is no God, but this is a family secret.”

Because Rationality can be a convenient way to take bog standard social conservatism and spin it into a superficially intellectualized form more palatable to these dorks. Basically what it comes down to is that dogmatic organized religion is good if you use big words to explain why it’s good.

Peterson does the same shit except with weird Jungian philosophy and floopy doopy self help spiritualism.

I actually kind of like the flavor of Jung's woo sometimes (so long as we're very clear that that's what it is), but I don't think I've ever liked the flavor of anyone who tries to co-opt it for their own ideology.

This is a long tradition among “rationalists”; in the nineteenth century, Auguste Comte created a Religion of Humanity to go along with Positivism.

"Catholicism minus the Christianity" as John Stuart Mill called it.

I’ve personally never experienced any material benefit from church attendance despite going for decades so I try to offer some sort of alternative in the event someone takes that advice to heart. My theory is that the social benefits of church stem from strong, preexisting community bonds, not the other way around. In an era of atomization and alienation churches likewise suffer.

tbh I’d be miffed if a person’s main reason for attending church was to meet chicks and make friends. If you’re actually religious you’d know that isn’t the point. You should continue to attend church even if everyone else there is ignoring you because Jesus is supposed to be all that matters.

Some of them are religious eg hlynka

They never really got rid of religion. Most are running basic Christian epistemology but with the spooky shit cut out and replaced with a Scientism. As they hit the limits of science as a truth-delivering mechanism, they pivot. Most are somewhere in the pivot motion, which takes time.

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My guess is Natural Law.
[john_gray.mov](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pgj3Nqs5LVM)

If I were to (over?)generalize I’d say that lots of rationalists experience on some level lots of difficulties in socializing with ‘normal’ people, finding meaning in everyday life, etc etc. They aren’t religious and don’t want to be, but they see the alternative universe in which they were raised as such as one where they wouldn’t be so disconnected and listless.

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What are they then? They all cite the same sources most Rationalists do. It's all Pinker, Haidt, Scott, Yud, Moldbug, the George Mason crew, etc.
Neo-reactionaries who like the title of "rationalist" because they think it means "people who are more rational and smart than everyone else." It's NRx meets r/iamverysmart.
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These are the capital R rationalists though. You can't just hand wave their favorite people as irrational. I agree they are, but Scott loves Jordan Peterso, Sam Harris, and Pinker. You are giving them way to much credit as free thinkers
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Rationalists don't do that though
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So not all Scotts? We know how the average Rationalist works by now. I've seen your posts and I agree with you, but to me it's insane think rationalists in general are like you.
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We agree then. I love the sequences and the original LW. I just hate what it has become.
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I blame Moldbug. For some reason Rationalists loved him. I am a woman and I thought I met the perfect guy, but he brought up Moldbug on our third date. He didn't even bring him up directly, I just knew when he said SJWs are derived from the Brahmin Protestants of Boston. I haven't talked to him since.
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Yeah dude. He thought it would impress me. He got super awkward when I was like wait did you crib this? I kind of feel bad for him he was actually really nice just a total far right guy and I'm just not interested in that. I'm in inpressed he tricked me for 2 dates
i'm sorry but lmao that's hilarious
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Was it you that I dumped? I'm sorry I hurt your feelings. It's kind of creepy to go through my post history though. It's time to move on.
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Apparently I'm interesting enough that you searched my whole post history. I must be doing something right if you and all your friends are so interested in me :)
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Don't be a creepy motherfucker.
No true Scotts-man?

Honestly? I’m one of those people, and it’s because it has played a massive role in my life, my family, and my community, and had a complex web of positive and negative effects with a great deal of the positive coming in ways that I haven’t seen replicated since I stepped away. I write plenty of criticism towards faith as well, but I see it as important to distinguish truth claims of an ideology from its lived experience.

Fair enough. But there are idiots on SSC who say the masses getting religion fixes everything.
Meh. There are blowhards in every sphere who say all sorts of rubbish. I like focusing on the few who make the best points.

Also, it seems like a lot of them read http://slatestarcodex.com/2015/03/25/is-everything-a-religion/ and then just decided to do the opposite.

Because they feel atomized and nihilistic, and they see this as a failure mode of modern, secular society.

Choose your warrior:

  • Bold of you to assume that all rationalists are atheists.
  • Because we’re not fedora shrek /r/atheism ableistslurs like you people.
  • Because - seriously, religion is absolutely wild, have you ever been to a church, they have community cohesion sorted, I said amen in unison with a bunch of other people and purely from the aesthetic trappings it felt meaningful.
You really should read the sequences

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**American civil religion** American civil religion is a sociological theory that a nonsectarian quasi-religious faith exists within the United States with sacred symbols drawn from national history. Scholars have portrayed it as a cohesive force, a common set of values that foster social and cultural integration. The very heavy emphasis on nondenominational religious themes is quite distinctively American and the theory is designed to explain this. The concept goes back to the 19th century, but in current form, the theory was developed by sociologist Robert Bellah in 1967 in his article, "Civil Religion in America". *** ^[ [^PM](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose?to=kittens_from_space) ^| [^Exclude ^me](https://reddit.com/message/compose?to=WikiTextBot&message=Excludeme&subject=Excludeme) ^| [^Exclude ^from ^subreddit](https://np.reddit.com/r/SneerClub/about/banned) ^| [^FAQ ^/ ^Information](https://np.reddit.com/r/WikiTextBot/wiki/index) ^| [^Source](https://github.com/kittenswolf/WikiTextBot) ^] ^Downvote ^to ^remove ^| ^v0.28

Agree, it’s bizarre. There’s a whole sub-current of, like, people converting to Catholicism or Mormonism so they can get access to the community infrastructure, and maybe/maybe not believing when they get in (thinking they can resist the memes??) but definitely believing after a while. And because the rationalsphere attracts people who take ideas super seriously, that means the religious believers inside it are super srs as well.