• lmmarsano@lemmynsfw.com
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    11 days ago

    Liberalism is basically capitalism

    Liberalism isn’t an economic system. It’s a political & moral philosophy from the Enlightenment that holds governments exist for the people & authority is legitimate only when it protects inalienable/fundamental/inherent rights & liberties of individuals. The people have an inherent right to obtain a government with legitimate authority, and when their government lacks or loses legitimacy, the people have a right & duty replace or change that government until it obtains legitimacy.

    Liberal governments can & do include some with social market economies (eg, social democracies in Europe).

    • Sibshops@lemmy.myserv.one
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      11 days ago

      But I mean an EL5 version is that liberals and socialists on the left both care about their neighbors. The disagreement is just how much of life should be handled by markets vs public/collective systems.

      • lmmarsano@lemmynsfw.com
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        11 days ago

        Which liberalism lacks an essential position on, because it’s not an economic philosophy. Liberalism is essentially the position that individual human rights & liberties are fundamental. It can even combine with socialism.

        Whatever disagreements you claim these philosophies have may be between particular variants you’re not specifying rather than their most general forms.

        • Sibshops@lemmy.myserv.one
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          11 days ago

          Modern liberalism in the US does have a position on economic philosophy.

          https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Modern_liberalism_in_the_United_States

          Economically, modern liberalism accepts a role for government to protect against market failures, protect competition and prevent corporate monopolies, and supports labor rights.[2] Its fiscal policy supports sufficient funding for a social safety net, while simultaneously promoting income-proportional tax reform policies to reduce deficits. It calls for active government involvement in other social and economic matters such as reducing economic inequality, expanding access to education and healthcare, and protection of the shared natural environment.[3]

          • lmmarsano@lemmynsfw.com
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            10 days ago

            Right, and modern US liberalism isn’t general liberalism. Plus, those distinctly modern elements absent from general liberalism of active non-market interventions by the government to protect the market from failure, provide a safety net, provide access to education & healthcare, provide public services to reduce inequality, protect the environment, etc, are social departures from capitalism, are they not? That position aligns better with social democracy

            a social, economic, and political philosophy within socialism

            social democracy aims to strike a balance by advocating for a mixed market economy where capitalism is regulated to address inequalities through social welfare programs and supports private ownership with a strong emphasis on a well-regulated market

            If anything, modern US liberalism conflicts more with your earlier assertion that

            Liberalism is basically capitalism

            Whereas general liberalism is largely indifferent to economic system, modern US liberalism favors a form of socialism.

            • Sibshops@lemmy.myserv.one
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              10 days ago

              You are right, but 99% of the time when people on this site talk bad about liberals, they mean modern liberalism in the US. Not classical or general liberalism.