I can start an instance right now. But that doesn’t mean it will have any kind of importance. If I can create new spaces, and let’s say it grows, wouldn’t the problems from the first instance just carry over.
So I’m wondering how this is a solution to safe guard against tech billionaires?
Because it isn’t a singular space. An instance that goes bad can be tethered from the rest of the wider network, and abandoned, leaving it on its own.
I can start an instance right now. But that doesn’t mean it will have any kind of importance. If I can create new spaces, and let’s say it grows, wouldn’t the problems from the first instance just carry over.
I don’t know what you mean by “problems with the first instance”.
Ok please humor me then here. Can you walk me through a situation where an instance would untether itself. One day lemmy becomes super popular. People notice it as a platform to get information on. Millions of views an hour. Peter Thiel is paying chinese click farms to post manosphere content in popular lemmy communities. Musk is linking “no kings 5.0” lemmy posts to his followers on X who are brigading the comments. The moderators of the most popular lemmy.world communities are Marvel executives and Billionare Pedophiles.
So now we abandon it and leave. What does that mean as far as protecting that instance from that same thing happening?
We’ve cut the hyrda’s head clean off. Now what? Do users all move to the new instance? Is all the bad from the first instance just going to contain itself to that instance? What protection is in place?
Ok please humor me then here. Can you walk me through a situation where an instance would untether itself. One day lemmy becomes super popular. People notice it as a platform to get information on. Millions of views an hour. Peter Thiel is paying chinese click farms to post manosphere content in popular lemmy communities. Musk is linking “no kings 5.0” lemmy posts to his followers on X who are brigading the comments. The moderators of the most popular lemmy.world communities are Marvel executives and Billionare Pedophiles.
I think this is so ridiculous as to essentially constitute fantasy. Lemmy.world, the largest Lemmy instance has about 40% of the active userbase (and declining slowly as a share of overall users) out of a pool of about 40k users. I don’t think that’s sufficient if Lemmy.world tried to cut itself off from every other network, they’d shed a lot of users who have people and communities they interact with outside of the main instance.
If Lemmy became popular, it across the instances would become popular. Not just one instance.
If for some reason a single instance did become hyperpopular and obnoxious to interact on, the lemmy software would still be accessible to rebuild another ecosphere elsewhere.
So now we abandon it and leave. What does that mean as far as protecting that instance from that same thing happening?
I’m not sure you know what an “instance” is. Can you tell me what you think an instance is?
paying chinese click farms to post manosphere content
I block people, I block instances, I block communities. Problem solved. It looks like you’re stirring shit like an annoying russian agent that would love to stir shit.
You know what I’ll do after reading all the comments in this thread? I’ll block you because you’re annoying, and then the problem will be solved.
I think you should take a more constructivist approach - what we have now, rather than what we might have in the future. Currently we have a network of like 20 major servers, mostly federated with each other. If one of those servers becomes insanely popular and overrun with bots and garbage, the rest will simply defederate from it. From the perspective of users on those other servers, they’ve only lost 5% of the network they liked. From the perspective of users who were on the popular server before it went to shit, they now have to move servers but still have 95% of the old network as they remember it.
Do users all move to the new instance?
What incentive is there for them to move? By the very nature of hype explosions, they are exponential, and as such most users will have joined when it was already quite popular. They won’t remember the “good old days” of their server being federated, so for them it’s fine to be isolated on a garbage server, at least initially. I suspect if something like this were to happen, most other servers will also limit signups for some time, to keep the spirit of the network alive and growing organically.
I’ve long surmised that the future of lemmy / activitypub is a fragmented one. Federation only works if everyone instances are participating in good faith. There are instances that are generally not federated with because they do not participate in good faith.
If at any point you feel that “billionaires” are encroaching on your experience, there will always be a next refuge.
How is that going to protect the space?
I can start an instance right now. But that doesn’t mean it will have any kind of importance. If I can create new spaces, and let’s say it grows, wouldn’t the problems from the first instance just carry over.
So I’m wondering how this is a solution to safe guard against tech billionaires?
Because it isn’t a singular space. An instance that goes bad can be tethered from the rest of the wider network, and abandoned, leaving it on its own.
I don’t know what you mean by “problems with the first instance”.
Ok please humor me then here. Can you walk me through a situation where an instance would untether itself. One day lemmy becomes super popular. People notice it as a platform to get information on. Millions of views an hour. Peter Thiel is paying chinese click farms to post manosphere content in popular lemmy communities. Musk is linking “no kings 5.0” lemmy posts to his followers on X who are brigading the comments. The moderators of the most popular lemmy.world communities are Marvel executives and Billionare Pedophiles.
So now we abandon it and leave. What does that mean as far as protecting that instance from that same thing happening?
We’ve cut the hyrda’s head clean off. Now what? Do users all move to the new instance? Is all the bad from the first instance just going to contain itself to that instance? What protection is in place?
I think this is so ridiculous as to essentially constitute fantasy. Lemmy.world, the largest Lemmy instance has about 40% of the active userbase (and declining slowly as a share of overall users) out of a pool of about 40k users. I don’t think that’s sufficient if Lemmy.world tried to cut itself off from every other network, they’d shed a lot of users who have people and communities they interact with outside of the main instance.
If Lemmy became popular, it across the instances would become popular. Not just one instance.
If for some reason a single instance did become hyperpopular and obnoxious to interact on, the lemmy software would still be accessible to rebuild another ecosphere elsewhere.
I’m not sure you know what an “instance” is. Can you tell me what you think an instance is?
I block people, I block instances, I block communities. Problem solved. It looks like you’re stirring shit like an annoying russian agent that would love to stir shit.
You know what I’ll do after reading all the comments in this thread? I’ll block you because you’re annoying, and then the problem will be solved.
I think you should take a more constructivist approach - what we have now, rather than what we might have in the future. Currently we have a network of like 20 major servers, mostly federated with each other. If one of those servers becomes insanely popular and overrun with bots and garbage, the rest will simply defederate from it. From the perspective of users on those other servers, they’ve only lost 5% of the network they liked. From the perspective of users who were on the popular server before it went to shit, they now have to move servers but still have 95% of the old network as they remember it.
What incentive is there for them to move? By the very nature of hype explosions, they are exponential, and as such most users will have joined when it was already quite popular. They won’t remember the “good old days” of their server being federated, so for them it’s fine to be isolated on a garbage server, at least initially. I suspect if something like this were to happen, most other servers will also limit signups for some time, to keep the spirit of the network alive and growing organically.
An instance doesn’t need to federate with others.
I’ve long surmised that the future of lemmy / activitypub is a fragmented one. Federation only works if everyone instances are participating in good faith. There are instances that are generally not federated with because they do not participate in good faith.
If at any point you feel that “billionaires” are encroaching on your experience, there will always be a next refuge.
Truth Social is Mastodon, its just not federated, either is Gab for that matter (thank fuck).
Bluesky needs a bridge and alas assholes keep making then