“It should come as no great surprise that a Democratic Party which has abandoned working class people would find that the working class has abandoned them,” Sanders said.

“First, it was the white working class, and now it is Latino and Black workers as well. While the Democratic leadership defends the status quo, the American people are angry and want change. And they’re right.”

“Will the big money interests and well-paid consultants who control the Democratic Party learn any real lessons from this disastrous campaign?” Sanders asked.

“Will they understand the pain and political alienation that tens of millions of Americans are experiencing? Do they have any ideas as to how we can take on the increasingly powerful Oligarchy which has so much economic and political power? Probably not.”

  • They need to swing for the fences more. Don’t just bring forward the items that might pass, bring up the bills that really matter, again and again, and put that in an ad. I’m probably more politically in-tuned than most voters (clearly) and I only know of ONE vote to raise the minimum wage during Bidens term. It should’ve been a dozen votes and then Dems get to say they were fighting for the working class while the GOP gets paid to show up and say “No” to everything.

    • @prole@lemmy.blahaj.zone
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      Are you referring to the upcoming lame duck session? Because Dems have a couple of months to try that, and then it looks like the openly fascist GOP is going to control all three branches of our federal government.

    • @LovableSidekick@lemmy.world
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      Yeah I forget who said it but I remember a commentator in 2016 complaining that Democrats seemed afraid to get out their and really be Democrats. But TBH I felt like Kamala was doing that.

      • @AfricanExpansionist@lemmy.ml
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        That party of the Roosevelt is gone since the Clintons showed up. It’s market-based solutions organization nothing. If you don’t like it, you can forfeit your tax rebate

  • @theherk@lemmy.world
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    2026 days ago

    I will always blame DWS, Clinton, and to a slightly lesser extent Brazile for the ruin of the party. Until there is proportional representation (i.e. never), there will never be a party that represents a great many of us.

  • @AidsKitty@lemmy.world
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    4226 days ago

    Democrats have definitely become the elitist party. They parade their rich celebrity friends around to inspire your vote. Can it become more ridiculous?

    • @Furbag@lemmy.world
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      726 days ago

      And you’re saying “billionaire” Donald Trump up on stage with the wealthiest man in the world is somehow more in-touch?

      Jesus Christ, get real you guys.

    • @hglman@lemmy.ml
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      226 days ago

      Just wait until Ted Cruz switches parties and runs as a dem for President in 2028

    • @emmy67@lemmy.world
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      Don’t you mean Trump? The literal billionaire who represents the richest man in the world? Weird

      • @boonhet@lemm.ee
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        2426 days ago

        Yea but with the republicans you already sorta expect it. Harris pivoted from a really sensible campaign that honestly I think would’ve won, to “look at all these rich people, celebrities and even right-wing warmongers who support me!” - and while I get the point - a dirtbag like Cheney supporting Harris is a sign of how fucked up Trump REALLY is - the message might not have been as clear to everyone.

  • @goldenlocks@lemmy.world
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    326 days ago

    Shut the fuck up Bernie, you’ve spent 8 years corralling the working class into the undemocratic party controlled by the rich. Fuck you, you could have actually tried to start a new party but no, you did your job as a tool of the capitalists to keep people voting against their interests.

    • @Aermis@lemmy.world
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      926 days ago

      What have you read about Bernie that justifies your outrage against him? Because he’s done none of that.

    • @RatzChatsubo@lemm.ee
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      326 days ago

      I agree that I didn’t agree with him towing the line. But you can’t argue that’s he’s been nothing but a source of good at least at the Senate level and inspiring new progressives

    • @kyle@lemm.ee
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      4026 days ago

      Saying that Bernie is garbage because he didn’t dismantle the two party system seems a bit extreme. He actually has joined third parties but they didn’t take off. He’s also definitely anti-capitalist.

      • @goldenlocks@lemmy.world
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        125 days ago

        He actually has joined third parties but they didn’t take off.

        Absolute bullshit. He had the ear of the country in recent years, and could have told everyone to support a third party. Instead he funneled them into the undemocratic party.

      • Rozaŭtuno
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        626 days ago

        He’s a socialdemocrat, which is still capitalism but with welfare.

        • @kerrigan778@lemmy.world
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          325 days ago

          Depends on what definition you use, classically a social Democrat is someone who believes in using democratic means to gradually and peacefully transition from capitalism to socialism. The definition you are using is actually closer to a social liberal but even that isn’t quite right, welfare does not imply a mixed market economy on its own, welfare can exist in a pure laissez fair market economy. Social liberalism is in favor a mixed market economy which is a further step left from simply a regulated market economy with welfare. In a mixed market economy key industries are publicized and owned and operated by the government for the public benefit while allowing for the possibility of private competition as well as an open market economy in other industries and areas.

        • @kyle@lemm.ee
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          525 days ago

          That’s fair, you’re right. I was pulling my comment from memory of him fighting against de-regulation of corporations, which I consider to be an anti-capitalist stance. But I shouldn’t have conflated the two.

  • Granbo's Holy Hotrod
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    6526 days ago

    We need to MAGA up the liberals. They think liberals were insufferable before, we about had enough of this establishment bullshit.

    • NaibofTabr
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      1726 days ago

      I don’t know about MAGA, but the Democratic party definitely needs to go hard into the same kind of obstructionism that the Republicans have been doing. No validation of insane policies, no negotiating with terrorists.

      And when everyone accuses the Democrats of not cooperating, they need to just stay quiet and stay the course. For the next four years, the legislature is closed.

      • @svtdragon@lemmy.world
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        225 days ago

        I saw on one of the newscasts on election night that the overturning of Chevron deference is going to come back to kneecap the whole GOP agenda because they’ll have to pass all their (de)regulatory changes through Congress which will be, as you say, closed.

      • Eugene V. Debs' Ghost
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        1226 days ago

        Republicans can be evil and Democrats work with them an compromise on killing half of them.

        Democrats consider maybe paying postal workers and Republicans stop it and cry how it’s unconstitutional to have people paid for their labor.

        If the Democrats got a spine and told Republicans “Just shut up, you complained about breaking segregation.” And get things done, we’d be a fucking utopia.

    • bquintb
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      1026 days ago

      I’m pretty sure that’s what we were trying to do back in 2016, but it was her turn.

      • Granbo's Holy Hotrod
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        Nah, I’m good. Been punk rock long enough to know it’s just gonna be the thing to hate. Just planning in my head how the subversion works this time. I just hope they tear it ALL down this time and stop f’ing around.

  • @VantaBrandon@lemmy.world
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    1326 days ago

    Rings a bit hollow. Biden stood up for unions, did not interfere with strikes, and always sided with the worker.

    The other party… celebrating layoffs, cutting the fat, blocking unions.

    So sure, maybe they could be better. But to say they abandoned the American worker, thats a bit of a stretch.

    Love Bern, but right now he’s playing Monday morning QB.

    • pachrist
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      2026 days ago

      My guy, Biden blocked a railroad workers strike because it endangered corporate interests, and he didn’t give them a key piece they were asking for: paid sick leave.

          • @Mjpasta710@midwest.social
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            626 days ago

            I agree, optics matter to the public and media.

            The media has sane washed an insane old person, while negatively spinning or outright ignoring any Biden accomplishment.

            The fact is, in this system, we’re trying to convince a small group of undecided folks in a few swing states to get involved and make a choice.

            The majority of the public is too tired and busy to bother to review the facts, and happy to watch an opinion of the matter - whether it’s true or not.

            If it fits into their world-view there’s no need to challenge it.

            • @hglman@lemmy.ml
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              226 days ago

              No, that undecided group does not exist, this election clearly demonstrated that. Trump results are nearly identical to 2020. What exists are people who are not engaged or disalusioned. They also are poor and going to vote is a meaningful event that takes energy that they don’t have.

              • @Mjpasta710@midwest.social
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                526 days ago

                Yeah, you’re acting in bad faith here too.

                The numbers of votes clearly show over 24 million people sat out 2024 vs 2020.

                Undecided doesn’t mean they’ll make a decision on voting day.

                I know of several people who willingly sat out because the state they’re in was always decided and they didn’t feel it would matter.

        • @jatone@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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          26 days ago

          4, not the 7 they wanted or deserved. he doesn’t get any credit for this. he broke the strike weakening their position.

          • @Mjpasta710@midwest.social
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            826 days ago

            I’m partially agreeing, I want to point out that they did get 7 days allotted.

            Not all 7 of those are from sick time, so you’ve got a point.

            I find it a reach to say the administration gets no credit when it’s definitely been assigned to them on multiple fronts for the effort.

            Congress was involved here too. Do you think our president should be a despot?

            Were you directly involved in negotiations?

            The people who were directly involved, gave the Biden administration credit for an assist.

            • @jatone@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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              426 days ago

              Dig deeper the people who gave credit were the same members who didn’t support the strike in the first place. iirc.

              I blame everyone involved who voted to break the strike. don’t try to assert for me things I havent asserted.

              • @Mjpasta710@midwest.social
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                326 days ago

                So you don’t acknowledge when you’re wrong, and will continue to move goalposts. You’re taking a defensive posture.

                It’s becoming clear now.

                You’re a bad faith actor.

                • @jatone@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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                  426 days ago

                  You’re of course welcome to continue believing that. Thats of course your prerogative. But I’m just going to point to the results since they speak for themselves.

                  Harris is missing 20million votes. You were warned and decided that arguing with me about the lesser evil ‘optimal voting strategy’ than realizing the danger harris was putting you in was a good idea. 👍 Good job. Now go convince those 20million other individuals since you’ve failed here.

                  You know what they say, you can lead a horse to water, but you can’t make them drink. (I know you struggle with analogies, you’re the 🐴)

    • GladiusB
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      6526 days ago

      Almost like he could have saved this whole scenario in 2016. Fuckin DNC kiss the ring Hillary bullshit.

    • @Timmy_Jizz_Tits@lemmy.world
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      3826 days ago

      At this point I’d be in favor of him just starting a podcast and enjoying retirement. The left has to go around the DNC to effectively deliver their message, it’s foolish to think otherwise.

      • @Jarix@lemmy.world
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        1626 days ago

        The dnc should all fall on their sword politically and admit that it would been better today had they given being their blessing and support when it would have mattered.

        Then give Bernie power in the dnc to craft the future of the party. Find a new direction while there’s still time

        • @Timmy_Jizz_Tits@lemmy.world
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          1026 days ago

          He’s 83. It’s best for him to leverage his celebrity than to really hunker down with an administrative role. If Trump can find true believers best believe the good guys can.

        • @prole@lemmy.blahaj.zone
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          526 days ago

          It’s cute to read all of these comments attempting to strategize without realizing that it’s all moot in a P2025 world.

          We are fucked. It’s too late to discuss realigning for “the next election,” because there will never be a (fair) one ever again.

            • @prole@lemmy.blahaj.zone
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              225 days ago

              Yeah. I am. What is your point?

              If you or anyone else thinks what I’m saying is hyperbolic, then I want you to remember this exchange in 6 to 12 months.

              • @Jarix@lemmy.world
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                325 days ago

                If germany is an ally today the US then its never too late to keep fighting.

                But you are absolutely entitled to feel like its pointless. Its not true, one might even say there has never been a fair election since the creation of the electoral college.

                To say there will never be another fair election is hyperbolic.

                I’ve probably got another 35 years, 67 more if im really lucky, you will have to give me more than 6 to 12 months.

                I genuinely hope this doesnt cause a new civil war or worldwar. But im not willing to bet it isnt a precipice that has just been driven past, im waiting for a fall

                • @octopus_ink@lemmy.ml
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                  124 days ago

                  I’ve probably got another 35 years, 67 more if im really lucky

                  That seems like a really big spread. I’ve probably got another 30, but nowhere near 60 even if I"m really lucky, unless I’m like “statistical outlier” lucky.

                • @prole@lemmy.blahaj.zone
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                  You do know what had to happen to Germany for it to become what it is after WW2, right?

                  It was basically destroyed, and the allies rebuilt it. That shit ain’t happening again.

      • @GoodEye8@lemm.ee
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        3126 days ago

        Because the dnc would rather lose running center right to right wing policies than be actually progressive.

      • @iwndwyt@sh.itjust.works
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        3326 days ago

        In related news:

        In June 2016, a class action lawsuit was filed against the Democratic National Committee (DNC) and former DNC Chair Debbie Wasserman Schultz for violating the DNC Charter by rigging the Democratic presidential primaries for Hillary Clinton against Bernie Sanders. Even former Senate Minority Leader Harry Reid admitted in July 2016, “I knew—everybody knew—that this was not a fair deal.”

  • brandon
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    4326 days ago

    alienation

    Careful now, that sounds like one of them there socialism words.

  • Had Trump won in 2020, he’d have taken the fall for the Recession and Hyperinflation and it would have caused a 2008 effect. Populist Wave haulted, strangled in it’s crib by Coronachan.

    Had Trump won in 2020, he’d be done now and his VP would still be the democracy respecting Pence.

    Trump when elected in 2016 had no major plan and mostly left the employees of the state intact, and in 2020 the change was minimal. Now there’s a full blown scheme to control the government

    In 2020 they didn’t know how much they could get away with. They’ve seen the limits now.

    Winning in 2020 means no January 6th shattering the overton window and leading SCOTUS to some interesting choices about power.

    2020-2024 had one Supreme Court Justice to appoint. Now there’s another 2 if not 3

    In 2020 it would have been close. Now Democrats will have to regain ground, New Jersey New Hampshire and Minnesota are now Swing States.

    2016 Trump had his populist wave weakened by Gary Johnson and Evan McMulin who blocked the popular vote and kept states like Colorado and New Mexico out of his hands. 2016 Trump sucked with Hispanics. That initial wave would have burnt out with the COVID fuckery. Instead Democrats slotted in, took the 4 worst possible years, and are handing it back having effectively both given them another shot in the arm and crippled themselves. There goes the court. This isn’t John Kerry, it’s Carter.

    I’ve heard of 2020 hindsight, but this is ridiculous

    • @boonhet@lemm.ee
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      2020-2024 had one Supreme Court Justice to appoint. Now there’s another 2 if not 3

      And you bet your ass they’ll appoint them as young as possible so they’ve got their pocket justices for another 40 or 50 years.

  • @UsernameHere@lemmy.world
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    I don’t buy this. In Nebraska there was an election between an independent union leader and a career politician. The union leader lost.

    The consensus seems to be that people that voted democrat in 2020 voted republican this time because they experienced inflation under Biden that think it was his fault.

    • @sigmaklimgrindset@sopuli.xyz
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      2626 days ago

      The consensus seems to be that people that voted democrat in 2020 voted republican this time because they experienced inflation under Biden that think it was his fault.

      What consensus is saying this? Outside of Latino men and first time voters shifting to Trump, most analysis (so far) is that the Democrats lost around 10-15 million votes from 2020, compared to Trump losing only 2 million. If all the Dems/Undecideds moved to Trump, he would have not lost voters.

      What was the Red vs Blue turnout in Nebraska in 2020 vs 2024, I bet that would go a long way to explain why the union leader lost.

      • @generalpotato@lemmy.world
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        726 days ago

        Agreed. That “consensus” is another bs talking point to cover up that they yet again alienated their own voters to appease their masters.

    • @orcrist@lemm.ee
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      426 days ago

      First of all, it is hard to beat career politicians. They have a track record, experience. Second, you’re in Nebraska. Third, and most importantly, the goal is not for a single person to win, but to build a strong organization that will make people’s lives better, and that would over time get more people to vote, because they would understand that it matters.

      In other words, big corporate Democrats are mediocre at best, and often much worse than that, so of course people stay home. But if you think they’re the wave of the future, hey, do whatever you like.

      • @UsernameHere@lemmy.world
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        426 days ago

        First of all, it is hard to beat career politicians.

        This counters what Bernie said.

        Second, you’re in Nebraska.

        I’m not in Nebraska. Just giving one of many examples of politicians that support the working class losing because of the billionaire class.

        Third, and most importantly, the goal is not for a single person to win, but to build a strong organization that will make people’s lives better, and that would over time get more people to vote, because they would understand that it matters.

        Scapegoating the democrats that tried to tax the billionaire class prevents this from happening.

        But if you think they’re the wave of the future, hey, do whatever you like.

        I don’t think they’re the wave of the future. I think the billionaire class countered Harris because they didn’t want to be taxed like she laid out in her plans and now people are trying to scapegoat them, ensuring it will be less likely that the next person will try it again. Just like the billionaire class wants.

    • @Zaktor@sopuli.xyz
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      4626 days ago

      In Nebraska

      Uh, that’s your answer. It’s not a magic incantation to win regardless of the odds, but in a presidential election that’s by default 50/50?

      • @UsernameHere@lemmy.world
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        3026 days ago

        If the problem was that democrats did not support the working class enough then why didn’t the union leader win? This isn’t magic or rocket science. Many people thought democrats were responsible for the high inflation because they don’t know macro economics.

        • Semi-Hemi-Lemmygod
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          1826 days ago

          If the problem was that democrats did not support the working class enough then why didn’t the union leader win?

          He had the albatross of a poor up-ballot candidate around his neck. Same reason most Democrats lost: The party didn’t get people to go out and vote because they didn’t appeal to workers, which hurt every candidate that wasn’t Republican.

          • @UsernameHere@lemmy.world
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            626 days ago

            Voters are literally saying it was because of inflation during Biden presidency.

            Democrats lost because they planned to tax the billionaire class so the billionaires funded the campaign against them.

            • @Bookmeat@lemmy.world
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              926 days ago

              Except Democrats outspent Republicans by a large margin. This wasn’t an election lost from a lack of donations.

              • @UsernameHere@lemmy.world
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                626 days ago

                Donations are on the books. Things like Elon Musk buying votes are not on the books. The billionaire class did not want Harris to tax them.

        • @vmaziman@lemm.ee
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          2126 days ago

          I think what’s missing is the anger. Trump can tap into anger. Bernie could also. The independent didn’t have the base of anger that the GOP did

          • @UsernameHere@lemmy.world
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            626 days ago

            Anger definitely motivated some but I know many moderates that were convinced democrats were responsible for the inflation.

            • @vmaziman@lemm.ee
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              But they were right! Dems did contribute to inflation (not as much as Trump but still)…Student loan forgiveness not explicitly tied to higher taxes on rich and corps, cutting back on subsidies to defense, oil, and corn syrup, while also not breaking up monopolies which create an environment of price gouging gave merit to the “democrats give out free cash and devalue it all”

              Democrats did cause inflation. They did it by not clipping the wings of our oligarchs when supplying aid.

              Biden kept his promise “nothing will fundamentally change” and the American electorate unimpeachably rejected it.

              The main thing with Sanders campaign was it didn’t feel like a “democrats” vs “republicans”

              It was us vs the billionaires

              But the DNC could never bear to alienate their biggest donors.

              • @UsernameHere@lemmy.world
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                Biden was calling out price gouging throughout his whole presidency.

                Harris lost this election because she said she was going to tax the billionaires and so they funded the campaign against her.

                For you to throw her under the bus after the billionaires campaigned against her is just going to ensure no future politicians will challenge the billionaire class again.

                • @sacredfire@programming.dev
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                  Harris had more billionaire donors than Trump and she out-raised him almost by $700 million. Of course there was plenty of dark money floating around and Musk dropped a ton of money into Pennsylvania, but don’t act as if Biden and Harris were working class darlings. Calling out price gouging is all good and well, and realistically, there’s only so much the president can do legally to combat inflation, but he did have the bully pulpit and a little bit of lip service to price gouging was not enough obviously. He could’ve been out there daily essentially doxing these companies and their ceos putting the fear of God in them.

                  Populism is a dirty word to the establishment, but both Trump and Bernie are populists. In fact, the first part of their message is essentially the same: America is going to shit, the Economy is terrible, and you’re getting fucked. The difference, of course, is that Trump points the finger at immigrants and others as the reason why this happening, while Bernie points the finger at the Oligarchs. The true power of populism is the threat of using the majority against the minority. It’s why it can lead to violence and mob rule.

                  People want someone to pay for the pain they are feeling, Trump is doing that, although of course it’s completely misguided and fucked up. The Democrats are not willing to do that. At some point, they’re going to need a Teddy Roosevelt like figure who comes along and essentially says to them, “hey listen I know it’s crazy, but if we don’t do something about the wealth inequality and the ruling class, we’re all gonna get our heads chopped off.”

        • @Zaktor@sopuli.xyz
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          1026 days ago

          It’s not a magic incantation to win regardless of the odds

          Sorry, I guess I should have said this twice. You don’t win Nebraska just by touching up the progressive message a little. Propaganda still exists, party loyalty still exists, racism still exists. But he did a hell of a lot better than any slow and steady liberal candidate would do. And in races that aren’t in deep red states, doing better is enough to win.

    • @14th_cylon@lemm.ee
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      2226 days ago

      because they experienced inflation under Biden that think it was his fault.

      yeah, that’s problem all around the world, people are too dumb to understand how two years of covid and ongoing war in europe affects our lives and demand that someone just takes care of it.

      so in a year we will get populist pro-russian billionaire prime minister who will just start dropping more inflation money around and tells people “see? i will take care of you!” (while stealing some of these money for himself, of course)

      • @Bookmeat@lemmy.world
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        And Harris was too stupid to just come out and say that she’d do that. Not Trump though. See that huge sign behind him at rallies? “Trump will fix it”.

        The dem strategy should have been to bombast like Trump, but more. Make America greatER. Would have really taken the wind or of his sails, IMO.

        • @14th_cylon@lemm.ee
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          726 days ago

          yeah, i don’t think that trying to out-idiot an idiot is valid strategy, especially if you don’t aim at stupid voters.

    • @Timmy_Jizz_Tits@lemmy.world
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      2026 days ago

      They can control the narratives. Democrats haven’t done enough to break the “both sides are the same” narrative, this is a 32 year problem. It breeds apathy and apathy helps autocrats.