Anatoly Karlin @powerfultakes

Replying to @RichardHanania

I’m against legalizing bestiality because the animal consent problem hasn’t been solved, but probably actually will be quite soon thanks to Al (at least for the higher animals with complex languages). So why not wait a few more years. I don’t see disgust as a good reason. It was an evolutionary adaptation of the agricultural era against the spread of zoonotic illnesses, but technology will soon make that entirely irrelevant as well.

  • @self
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    217 months ago

    dear internet vegans trying to start fights online by comparing eating meat with raping animals: fuck off

    dear insecure meat eaters who think anyone gives a fuck you don’t like vegans: see above

  • @WaxedWookie@lemmy.world
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    547 months ago

    There’s no animal I’m aware of that has a mental capacity beyond that of a child. We don’t think children are capable of giving consent - are we clearing the way to legalise paedophilia too, or are there animals with the mental capacity to provide informed consent that only lack the ability to communicate that consent?

    Spoiler: It’s not a communication issue. If this technocratic psycho was more concerned with actually contemplating the morality of the question, and less focused on rearranging the insides of a parrot, his takes might be a little less monstrous.

    • @sue_me_please
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      7 months ago

      If this technocratic psycho was more concerned with actually contemplating the morality of the question, and less focused on rearranging the insides of a parrot, his takes might be a little less monstrous.

      It’s always funny realizing those who think they’re asking the tough questions that others aren’t smart enough to consider only ever talk about the same handful of topics: putting down minorities, advocating white supremacy, whining about anyone to the left of Pinochet and fucking animals/kids.

      Like that’s 95% of the content on the Motte or "I"DW.

      • @naevaTheRat@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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        137 months ago

        lgbt rights bad because Chesterton fence something something.

        also

        Consent standards:

        (╯°o°)╯︵ ┻━┻

        (ᕗ ͠° ਊ ͠° )ᕗ [dolphussy]

        • @bitofhope
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          97 months ago

          A bit of a tangent but I loathe the Chesterton’s fence argument. Not only does it shift the burden of proof to proving a negative (“show me this thing is not actually beneficial”) but it straight up demands you to make the conservative argument for them. Before you get rid of this bad thing, please demonstrate your understanding of why it’s good actually!

          • @froztbyte
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            77 months ago

            a cursed idea I just had: chesterton’s fence is the engine of sealioning

      • @WaxedWookie@lemmy.world
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        97 months ago

        Kinda makes you wonder what they’d be capable of if they stopped spending all their time whining that they can’t say the thing they never fucking shut up about.

      • @froztbyte
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        7 months ago

        or "I"DW.

        ah yes the interminable dork web

        are they still running that theme?

        (e: shower thought, had a better i)

        • @sue_me_please
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          57 months ago

          Not after all of the “intellectuals” showed their asses on Twitter or in real life lol

          Can only play that card as long as you don’t give away your hand by being a complete moron in public over and over again

    • SharkAttak
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      277 months ago

      Considering that US Republicans are OK with marrying and impregnating 12y olds, everything is possible, sadly.

      • @WaxedWookie@lemmy.world
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        167 months ago

        …and that’s just what they openly advocate for - It sickens me to contemplate the bit they’re too uncomfortable to share.

    • @naevaTheRat@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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      157 months ago

      I don’t want to endorse dolphin fucking or whatever but idk if we can necessarily very accurately map non human intelligence onto stages of human intelligence development. Like human children can idk stack blocks but they’re also very emotionally volatile and forgetful. Whales can’t stack blocks but they have a lot of emotional stability, good memories, and large stable social groups. How do you map between that? They’re not human.

      In some ways non human animals appear very similar, especially other mammals and their social relationships and emotions. In other ways they appear very different. They’re their own thing and I think overly simplifying their minds by trying to work out some human age equivalent will just mislead us. It’s not like a pig that can do calculus would suddenly become a reasonable romantic partner haha.

    • @nehal3m@sh.itjust.works
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      17 months ago

      Philosophical question: if brutally torturing and murdering billions of animals is fine, why do we draw the line at sex? I’m a vegetarian and have never ideated it, but the position is untenable.

      • @selfA
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        217 months ago

        HMMMMM I WONDER

        shots are on me tonight, vegetarian reply guy with pretend opinions was my last square before blackout!

      • @swlabr
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        77 months ago

        “I can excuse bestiality, but I draw the line at animal cruelty”

      • @WaxedWookie@lemmy.world
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        37 months ago

        I think your framing is flawed (I don’t think it’s an issue of consent so much as it’s an issue of creating animal suffering for personal benefit), but I broadly agree - I personally get past the hypocrisy because I have no interest in fucking animals, and push the suffering I cause by eating animal products to the back of my mind and pretending it’s not a thing. Responsibility is also meaningfully abstracted in the food example, making it far easier to pretend you’re not at fault compared to having a chicken impaled on your dick.

        In a similar way, people consuming products made in sweatshops and people downloading CSA material are both exploiting children.

  • Steve
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    447 months ago

    i like how he sees the “consent problem” as just a communication thing. “if they could speak, they would be saying yes”

    • @swlabr
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      137 months ago

      perhaps he’s not hoping for “animals able to enthusiastically consent” but is in fact hoping for “animals amenable to participating in the free market and the world’s oldest profession”

      • Steve
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        137 months ago

        “I don’t see disgust as a good reason” shows he hasn’t considered reasons why a chihuahua would dissent

        • @locallynonlinear
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          97 months ago

          Looking forward to when the grizzly bear grunts in his direction and he has to decide which reaction is the clear non consent one.

  • @naevaTheRat@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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    407 months ago

    Why do I feel like this guy knows exactly how far a Scooby snack gets you.


    How the fuck will LLMs help you flirt with Mr Snuffle paws? What is going on in this guy’s head?

    It’s fascinating seeing everyone project onto this things. Like a rorschach test of desires. You have the madcap industrialist slavering over firing all humans, the nerd rapturists, the sexbot enthusiasts, the doomsday preppers, and apparently dolphinfuckers now.

    • @Soyweiser
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      7 months ago

      LLMs are AGI, high intelligence is magic, so the AGI can not only understand language, it can understand the language of all beings, or if that is not possible, just uplift their intelligence and make them intelligence? How you ask? Well

      • @naevaTheRat@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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        177 months ago

        you just gave me a great idea for a comedy show.

        Nerd makeover except gpt is fed an image of the contestant and asked how to make them over. Contestant then goes to a mingle or speed dating or whatever. Using guidance from the chatbot on what to say and do.

        Can we bait tech cultists into this?

      • @naevaTheRat@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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        97 months ago

        Well first we feed it a big corpus of books written by dogs, and then we get a little shaggy with Scooby if you know what I mean.

    • @pohart@programming.dev
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      7 months ago

      This is so hard because every one of his arguments is wrong, but the worst thing is that he’s arguing this at all.

    • @sue_me_please
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      207 months ago

      These are the thoughts of the smartest people on Earth. If you don’t get it maybe you just aren’t that smart?

  • @swlabr
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    277 months ago

    I don’t think the guy even understands consent tbh.

    So why not wait a few more years

    The world this posits is wild. First, you’ve got a person wanting to commit bestiality, but only wants it if it is legal, otherwise, why wait? Second, we’re going to both translate animal language (or neural activity if you wanna go steelman) into human language and back. And third, we’re gonna use that to successfully teach animals sex education (that, mind you, many countries already don’t have a great track record on teaching humans sex ed). Fourth, somehow these animals will be able to comprehend any of this in a meaningful way for the legal system to recognise their ability to consent (again, bad track record). And fifth the animals will actually consent.

    higher animals

    like, birds?

  • @sbv@sh.itjust.works
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    227 months ago

    I’ll be shocked when dude builds his translator, and every animal, rock, and inanimate object reliably says how much it wants to fuck him. Could the translator be wrong? No, he must be that desirable.

  • Dizzy Devil Ducky
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    227 months ago

    If there’s one thing I’ll definitely take a very conservative stance on, it’s that beastiality is absolutely disgusting and should not be legal, ever. If it’s something like Sonic or a fictional drawing of an anthro on e621, fine, but if it’s your pet dog Helga, you need serious help.

  • @froztbyte
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    187 months ago

    Gotta wonder if that’s in any way related to how so many of those assholes have a hate-on for furries

      • @selfA
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        327 months ago

        it’s almost 2024 and somehow you still hate furries enough to announce it to strangers on the internet

        • @froztbyte
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          177 months ago

          which is extremely largely operated and supported by furries

  • @mountainriver
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    157 months ago

    Knowing just a smidgeon about how the statistical parrots work, I wonder were they will get the dataset for the animal languages.

    This reminds me, I read an article in Nature about teaching dogs to read. Now, this was a 19th century article in a 19th century Nature, so it described how the author had written “food” on a note and placed it on the food bowl and placed a blank note on an empty bowl and eventually gotten his dog to fetch the note that had “food” written on it. Alas, due to unforeseen circumstances, it was hard to expand into more advanced literature.

    So where to get the dataset? Nevermind, Magical AI to the rescue!

  • @sue_me_please
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    157 months ago

    Evolution is when all of the animal fuckers die from zoonotic diseases.

    • ChaoticNeutralCzech
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      7 months ago

      But soon they won’t because we’ll have something something TECH something something HEALTHCARE

      • @sue_me_please
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        107 months ago

        Techlords are coming to rescue with animal sex dolls and bots.

      • @froztbyte
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        67 months ago

        the only time they’d consider funding (actual) healthcare is when it affects them

  • Steve
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    127 months ago

    hey chatgpt, how do I bit flip my dog translator?

  • @sc_griffith
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    127 months ago

    looking at his dog what if the ai consents tho…

    • @sc_griffith
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      107 months ago

      I keep rereading the phrase “why not wait a few more years.” haunting

  • @gerikson
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    117 months ago

    the animal consent problem hasn’t been solved, but probably actually will be quite soon thanks to Al (at least for the higher animals with complex languages)

    CW discussion of bestiality

    So… there are animals with complex languages, which AI will help us understand, and we can then ask the animals if they are ok with us fucking them. (I’m not sure what animals these are. Dolphins? Whales? The great apes? The stereotypical victims of bestiality - barnyard animals raped by horny and/or lonely men - don’t seem to qualify to me)

    This raises further disturbing questions. Assuming we can really understand these animals enough for them to give consent to sex, where does this put humans who are now seen as unable to (the mentally disabled, children, elderly people with dementia)? If it’s both ok to have sex with a pig because an AI told us it was ok, and slaughter that same pig for food, then surely it’s ok to have sex with a kid, because they’re at least accorded more rights than most animals, and we don’t need AI to communicate with them.

    They either have not thought this through, or thought way too much about it.

    • @Umbrias@beehaw.org
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      57 months ago

      You’re on the right track. It’s long been established that non human animals cannot consent to sex because of the power difference between them, even if the non human animals could communicate well.

    • Deceptichum
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      17 months ago

      “If animals can give consent, that means children don’t need too”

      Tf kinda logic is that?

      • @gerikson
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        117 months ago

        The point is, how do we know that “animals can give consent”? “If you have sex with me, I won’t kill and eat you” is like the epitome of power imbalance.

        • Deceptichum
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          -27 months ago

          So let the Vegans fuck them, I don’t care about rationalising why people should fuck animals.

          My issue is with your fallacy of suggesting seeking consent leads to ignoring consent elsewhere.

          • @selfA
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            97 months ago

            So let the Vegans fuck them

            why was this necessary

            My issue is with your fallacy

            we don’t do that here. drop the debatelord shit