wtf did they expect?
What Texas media and social pressure told them to. That’s why we shouldn’t let billionaires and liars run the media
That’s letting them off the hook.
Im not sure if you’re calling for harsher punishments to the billionaires that own mainstream media or if you’re arguing that there should be further consequences for people that fell for a sophisticated misinformation campaign who are already suffering disproportionately under this administration.
I think it’s disingenuous to ignore the heavy conservative leanings of a significant portion of Hispanic households as well as any who immigrated “the right way” and are pissed off by undocumented workers.
I’m not arguing for either, although taxing/eating the rich should always be on the table.
I’m saying that while in the macro sense disinformation has had a devastating effect on society, I’m not ready to let those “fooled” by it off the hook. It’s the 2020s, if you’re fooled by disinformation to this degree, you’ve let yourself be fooled.
It’s nice to have the privilege of time to research or a good education to base things off of, isn’t it? I have them, too. Poverty and oppression doesnt give over a quarter of Americans (which is also disproportionately represented in the south) that leeway.
At some point you have to allow them their agency. They are adults, and only one of us is treating them as such.
Do you think you’re immune to disinformation? Oh right I forgot it’s only the other side that is being lied too you’re right everything you say and think is correct.
If people didn’t have time to get better information, Netflix, YouTube, Facebook et al would be worthless. They are not.
People made choices. Those choices are biting then in the ass. Education is not free. However, lack of knowledge can be fixed with some small amount of effort.
It can be hard to get absolute truths in an age of misinformation, but there was plenty of information that was common knowledge about truno and his racism. He’d also already had a pretty awful first term, which ended in an insurrection.
If they were fooled, it was wilful ignorance. That doesn’t mean we shouldn’t also hold the misinformation machine responsible, nor welcome them back into the fold of normalcy. If we, or they, don’t recognise that they bear responsibility also, it’s going to keep happening.
It’s a mistake to act as if blame is zero-sum. There’s plenty of blame to go around! Billionaires, the media, and the voters can all be responsible!
noy OP. but your argument is people don’t have agency.
on that we can agree, however, see Cipolla’s Laws on Stupidity 1, 3 and 5 in particular. You seem to have fallen for 4.
That’s on them. They have the same access to the world wide web as we do. Maybe if they spent more time doing their homework instead of posting pro-MAGA Minion memes, we’d all be better off.
They expected deportations of only the “bad mexicans”, not understanding thst every mexican is bad to this admin.
solidarity is a lost virtue in some communities.
The destruction of the left:
“We’re pissed off at the current administration. Everybody’s pissed off down here in south Texas,” the construction executive said, noting that most Hispanics in the area are Catholic. “Remember, we’re conservative, we’re not far left. We’re in the middle, conservative Latinos in south Texas. It doesn’t make sense.”
Bear in mind they are talking about what was probably the most conservative Democrat to hold office since the 50s.
This guy deserves whatever MAGA gives him
What doesn’t make sense? Conservatives want a white country.
They expected a scenario that would work out well for themselves. They didn’t put any effort into thinking about whether or not any given scenario would work out well for themselves, but the Republican media assured them it would work out, so why would they doubt that?
I dunno, 200 years of American racism and past Republican sentiments towards Mexicans and Hispanics might have been a tip in the right direction.
God forbid anyone educate themselves before sticking a knife in a lightsocket.
The Democrats to do the same. This was the year Democrats came up with yet another brilliant strategy to win over “moderate” Republicans by pivoting hard right on immigration, abandoning any talk of “building the wall is racist” in favor of “Trump doesn’t actually want to build the wall, we’re the ones who will actually do it.” Naturally, it didn’t do shit to win over anti-immigrant people who still saw them as weak on immigration compared to the Republicans, but it was quite effective at alienating immigrants and pro-immigration people.
Turns out, there’s a decent number of Hispanics with conservative inclinations who are willing to overlook them and vote Democrat, so long as they believe the Republicans are racist against them. Since the Democrats decided that criticizing anti-immigrant policies as racist was too alienating to racists, those conservative Hispanics lost the one reason they were willing to vote Democrat and voted based on culture war bullshit instead.
They did what daddy told them too and as mad as they are they will continue to vote red.
Thinking isn’t how Trump supporters become Trump supporters. Fear is.
Their propaganda networks told them to be more concerned about trans people and Haitian immigrants than real important topics.
They didn’t consider he’d actually do what he said he would do on immigration because they were too busy cowering in fear over bullshit culture war garbage and hyper focusing on that.
Plus, he’d only go after the bad ones, right?
Probably not concentration camps
Oh, they did, they just figured they’d be for someone else
It was because of Biden’s promise to cut back the gas industry in the SW.
They expected him to overthrow the governments in Latin America so they could go back to being petite bourgeois landlords on the south side of the border.
And he has helped overthrow a bunch of Latin American governments. So a bunch of them still like him.
On the money🎯.
Even Mexicans are only salty they can’t have slaves they used to oppress.
Please libs, tell us how Mexico still treats the Zapatistas.
They expected to become rich. They was the sum total of the thought.
I mean, he told you what he was tryinna do
he even did it before!
honestly, it is strange when he tells the truth.
I remember a video about an immigration lawyer, who also immigrated from Mexico, who said Trump was only going to go after the criminals. Therefore business would be great for her. I really want to see a follow-up.
strange, they can’t seem to find that person anymore to conduct a follow-up with.
For her that would have worked out.
I think they missed the part where Trump isn’t about stopping illegal immigration, just immigration. Past and present. For brown people.
“It just seems now more than ever, if you’re brown, they’re gonna stop you,” said Mario Guerrero, a three-time Trump voter who leads the South Texas Builders Association. “And I know that sounds really racist, but it’s what we’re facing, man.”
The Supreme Court essentially signed off on a Trump immigration enforcement policy to assume speaking Spanish and looking brown is sufficient evidence to suspect someone is an illegal immigrant. It is about as openly racist as you can get.
I guess Mr. Guerrero doesn’t like the bigotry now that he’s on the receiving end of it?
They are idiots. My family is full of Latinos who pull the ladder from behind. They also think they could be on the same level as white people. Nope.
History is filled with people who were promised that we would pretend they were white if they just sold out everyone they cared about. Hasn’t actually paid off yet.
The Irish might be an exception there. See How the Irish became White by Noel Ignatiev.
If the current fascist project has enough legs I guarantee you they will get around to reversing that.
It’ll end as a circular firing squad of jawless, haggard, pasty-white men.
And Italians!
People forget it was only like a century ago when Irish and Italians weren’t white enough for the wasps.
Not even that long ago. In Rocky, Stallone gets called slurs
They still remind us!
Depends where you’re at, my family doesn’t like the eye-towel-yans for some bizarre reason I’ve never been able to find out, but I guess that would be expecting racism to make sense.
The exception to this is when the definition of whiteness had to be expanded to maintain a white majority.
At the end of the day, those sorts of things always let you know who you can’t trust.
similar, my family is all MAGA, they don’t even live in America, they aren’t Americans, but absolutely adore MAGA.
Due to abusive ex, I live in the states fighting for my life to get a greencard so I don’t lose my daughters. My family is still MAGA.
If it’s a poll showing it and not a news story on a massive protest, they’re not really furious.
Would be pretty convenient for ICE if they did though, huh?
If they stopped voting Republican? Probably not.
Voting is more important than a massive protest.
Voting doesn’t work on fascism
if !progressivepolitics@lemmy.world comprehended this😔
That’s cool, but it was a month ago and not exactly “massive”. “Hundreds” of protesters out of the 7th most populous city in the country isn’t exactly proof of major demographical swings. In the 2020 census according to Wikipedia, more than 60% of the city’s 1.5 million residents was Hispanic, and that’s not counting the greater metro area. There’s also no demographical breakdown of the protesters—not that there necessarily should be, but without it, it’s hard to point to this as meaningful progress on the Hispanic voter front.
Just a reminder. Male Latinos are literally the reason Trump is in office right now. Kamala had the black and white support to win, but make Latinos swung like 40 pts hard right.
Indeed and racism played a heavy role while voting.
White racism yeah. If we removed the right to vote from white people and only let hispanics, asians, and black people vote then Harris would have won by a large margin.
So we’re all in on not letting whites vote, right? https://ropercenter.cornell.edu/how-groups-voted-2024
There should be a basic test of “are these actual problems” for voting, i.e. do immigrants actually hurt the economy, and most white people(who voted) would fail that test.
That’s supposed to be the journalists work. But you have Fox News employees instead…
This is some bullshit, on several levels.
White people voted 42%Harris, 57%Trump.
Hispanics voted 51% Harris, 46% Trump.
https://ropercenter.cornell.edu/how-groups-voted-2024 Does that look like a hispanic voting problem or a white problem?
Secondly, It gets complicated fast and I dont think can be easily reduced to “swung hard right”. The “latino” vote is diverse and encompasses a lot of peoples: Mexico, central, south America, and Cuba (All pretty different folks with different political pressures, history, and biases) Immigration, economic opportunity, skepticism of the democratic party caring about them, anger about gaza and disapproval of Bidens justice policies broadly, and a general rejection of the economic status quo all factored in. By how much? Hard to get great polling data on that. But Biden and then Harris’s message was literally that “nothing will fundamentally change”, at a time when his approval rates were very low.
This whole comment thread is angry people shitting on Latinos as if they were the problem instead of white voters.
Did you even read what you typed?
White people are republican’s BEST racial demographic and are essentially what keeps them competitive every election. And Harris managed to pull 42%, that’s very good for Democrat nationally in this era. In most elections, that would all but secure them the presidency.
But the big glaring issue is Trump pulling a massive 46% of the Hispanic vote. That’s the ball game right there. That Hispanic vote share for Trump nullified any blue wall Harris had with her existing white and black votes.
I’m not here to tell people who to vote for, I could care less after this country has already messed up big time allowing a 2nd Trump term. But you people who voted for Trump, have no one to blame, but themselves, and that includes the Hispanic vote. If you didn’t want to vote for Harris, then vote 3rd party or don’t vote at all. But giving Trump 46%, they are the absolute number 1 reason he’s in office right now.
So you are just giving up on the idea that whites are worth working on at all and want to just work on the hispanic vote, is that what you’re saying? As a white guy myself, that seems pretty cynical.
Nope. White people could fix all of this now if they simply voted better. But we know they won’t. No Dem has managed to win the white vote since Civil Rights passed. White people literally turned on the Dems over social issues.
Now let me tell you why the Hispanic vote is at fault instead. Barack beat John McCain by 10M votes, the largest presidential victory in the 21st century, Dems gained 59 seats in the senate off of that election. They had a large majority in the house after that election. 2008 is seen as good as Dem can perform in the modern era.
And you wanna what percentage Obama got the white vote in 2008?
43%
Yes, Obama got damn near the same percentage of white voters as Kamala Harris. And Trump around the same as McCain. Both Obama and Harris had lopsided black support.
So where does that leave us? Kamala more white support than Obama 2012, Biden and Hilary (way more than Hillary surprisingly). Yet, she performed worse than both of them and way worse than Obama. How could this be? The answer is simple.
HISPANIC VOTERS SWUNG LIKE 40 PTS TO THE RIGHT! NO DEM CAN WIN A PRESIDENTIAL ELECTION IF THE REPUBLICAN IS GETTING 46% OF THE HISPANIC VOTE!
There’s a big “why did you vote for Trump in the first place?” shaped hole in the middle of this story. Did the reporter not ask? Did they not think it was important?
Legally documented immigrants are often considerably more strict and harsh in their views on undocumented immigrants. A very “I did it right and so should you have too” mentality. This is particularly strong among refugee immigrants (Cuban and Venezuela, for example). The problem here is the perception that undocumented immigrants are all members of roving street gangs selling drugs and murdering an raping. Farm hands and construction workers can get documentation that passes the checks required of employers. So they weren’t expecting their own employees to be swept up in it.
They’re not stupid, just heavily propagandized to where they need to experience personal consequence to reconsider. It a perfect chance to have the conversation with them to win them over.
It a perfect chance to have the conversation with them to win them over.
lmk if you find a way to convince them.
I found “Hierba mala es cabezota” the hardway😔I mean some of them are definitely stupid. Stupid people exist in all population groups.
Because Biden promised to cut back on gas production in Texas.
Wow, what a bunch of fucking idiots.
Los morons
I am baffled someone actually didn’t understand when a far-right white male politician says “illegals” they’ve always meant “people of color”
It’s sort of like Springfield versus Shelbyville. To the people that live there, the difference is distinct and vast. To anyone on the outside, they might as well be the same place.
It’s Christianity. A ton of immigrant Hispanics are extremely Christian and Republicans are historically the Christian party
They say they are anyway.
Well they are. They’re just focused on those parts that are a bit less popular amongst ‘progressive christians’ such as hating the abortioners, the gays & the women
Good Catholic families, a lot of which are probably older and more established than the states they reside in.
I kind of half think there was a portion of Republicans that really believed that there were 100 illegal immigrants just going absolutely ham on the place and that was somehow the only real issue we had going on.
Jokes on us I guess.
Biggest problem is thinking of Hispanics as a monolith
