They’ll point to Israel, Israel, Israel. Okay, sure, agreed.
But when you point out that China, North Korea, and Russia are all engaging in a blatant genocide against Ukraine – they suddenly cannot grasp the concept!
My political sanity check is to ask what one’s opinion is on Ukraine and Palestine.
See Ukrainians as victims of genocide but not Palestine? Zionist piece of shit. Palestinians are victims but Russia is justified? Tankie piece of shit. Don’t approve of either genocide? Might be a sane human being that actually dislikes genocide itself.
See, I understand the sentiment, but then I also know many people who use terms like “tankie” also wouldn’t be super chill about anti-imperialism in any way related to abolishing the EU, US, Canada, Australia, etc. Not that is necessarily the case, but hardly worth focusing on “hypocrisy” without consistency.
You all for ending Canada or the US?
How are China and North Korea engaging in blatant genocide against Ukraine?
North Korea is supporting the Russian war effort by providing troops. North Koreans have been fighting alongside Russian soldiers for a long while now. It’s actually worse, because North Korean soldiers are on the front lines they’re getting experience fighting a modern war. Which means that if North Korea ever gets into a shooting war with South Korea or the United States they’ll have experienced troops. Right now the best thing to do would be support Ukrainian forces because they’re also gaining experience fighting a modern war and could teach those skills to American and NATO troops.
As for China, I don’t know.
Well yeah, Russia is also gaining experience in drone warfare. It’s just one reason why I’m against continuing this war. We’re literally building up Russia as our enemy. The military elites in Russia all support this war, and the war economy is going to build up their weapons capabilities long term.
China supports Russia in a similar, but lesser, way to the US supporting Israel.
Ah oh no you pointed to Israel so that argument just doesn’t count.
I mean if that counted you could say that almost all the western nations are “blatantly engaging in genocide” for supporting Israel or preventing sanctions. That basically normalized genocide. It becomes an everyday thing. Genocide, schmemocide.
Obviously the removal of Children by Russia is considered a war crime and can amount to ethnic cleansing.
NK provides troops and artillery shells. China keeps their market open to russi allowing drone and drone parts purchases - which are instantly weponized into loitering ammunition aka kamikaze drones
So basically all the following countries that are still engaging in trade with Israel are engaging in genocide against Palestine:
Argentina Australia Austria Brazil Canada China Costa Rica Czechia Denmark Ecuador Egypt Estonia Finland France Greece Hungary India Ireland Italy Japan Mexico Moldova Morocco Netherlands New Zealand Norway Paraguay Peru Philippines Poland Portugal Romania Singapore Slovakia South Korea Sweden Switzerland Thailand United Arab Emirates United Kingdom United States Uruguay Vietnam
Israel isn’t a democracy.
wat
Pfff, a real tankie would never admit it was for territorial expansion. Don’t you know Zelensky is the new Hitler? Russia is just saving Europe from Ukraine.
We should be thanking them.
(Totally not sarcasm, I’m super cereal)
if ukraine was facist russia would be supporting them, not invading.
When it happens more often that I see critics of a group make claims about what that group says or believes, and when I’ve never seen members of the group say anything that matches those claims, it makes me suspicious.
This is what warmed me up to veganism for example - growing up hearing nothing but arguments against vegans, and then when finally seeing some things a real vegan had to say and having to realize the vast majority of those anti-animal-rights arguments are grossly full of shit.
I’m getting the same vibes here. I don’t engage with political ideology much these days because theory makes my eyes glaze, but posts like these seem 1) suspicious af, and wouldn’t surprise me if they’re being pushed by paid actors, and 2) seem highly likely to be a strawman.
You want to be taken seriously, show evidence.
I’m sorry, you haven’t seen tankies say this on Lemmy?
You can look through this thread if you want confirmation.
They’re also in this very post.
Go look at any of the tankie communities, hell even c/leftymemes is full of this bullshit.
This is a strawman on a “the liberals are transing our kids” level. Maybe you do find some idiotic people actually arguing this nonsense, but that means nothing.
Most liberals and leftists are willing to ignore incontrovertible facts and overwhelming evidence that the invasion wasn’t as black and white. The CIA under Obama funded and trained the organizer of Euromaidan and with the help of far right elements in Ukraine managed the protests and a false flag massacre and to “regime change” Ukraine - overthrow a legitimately elected government. All of this is beyond reasonable doubt to anyone looking at the actual historical evidence. Russia reacted exactly like they said they would when the west “decided” in 2008 that Ukraine and Georgia was going to become members of Nato.
And still you’re willing to massively simplify a complex geopolitical history into a simplistic “good vs evil” narrative. Because nearly the entire western mainstream media says so, and everyone walks in lockstep.
When anybody points out that you are missing what this war is doing to the western world, to the media and our economies you loose your shit. Under Nato 3.0 (their actual name) 5% GDP for the new privatized military industrial complex in Europe. All justified by the great bogyman in the east.
Ukraine isn’t winning this war. It’s been 3 years and they are stuck. Do you want them to fight until the last man? Ukraine lost. The US empire is winning by bleeding Russia. And Russia is winning by bleeding Europe in return.
Nobody you would call “Tankie” actually apologizes Russia or their invasion. At least I haven’t seen one yet. Fuck Putin. But unlike you, I don’t close my eyes and pretend to know perfectly what is and what isn’t.
Your fervor enables the warmongering and jingoism. I would excuse ignorance but no doubt you’ve been shown the (western / ukrainian) sources (e.g. this and this and this) and choose to ignore the facts.
Like clockwork.
I should stop posting but i cant help myself
Nobody you would call “Tankie” actually apologizes Russia or their invasion. At least I haven’t seen one yet.
So like do you never read .ml posts on this stuff, or do you just do your best to ignore the comments you disagree with?
It doesn’t sound like this is directed at you when you’re not defending the invasion, so I don’t understand what this is a defense of. Nobody is saying the west is a saint either.
👍
I have a 35 year-old coworker who is a Ride Or Die Russian dick rider he doesn’t fully support Trump since the Epstein cover-up, but he still will praise him, but he fully supports Russia in its invasion of Ukraine saying that Ukraine is full of pedophiles and they need to be wiped off the Earth. And somehow achieving this will make our lives in America better and everything will be cheaper somehow…
It’s why Tucker Carlson supports them: they’re right-wing authoritarian nationalists.
My theory with Tucker and MTG is that they are sitting on the sidelines waiting for Donnie to die, and that will cause a power vacuum in maga and they will do everything in their power to take control and move the party in their own way forward, which I don’t think will work, but it will cause a spinoff, which will be worse than it was before.
You’re right, but I don’t think it’s really theory that the far-right also has factions.
Don’t give money to Ukraine because they’re evil fascists. Let Putin and his glorious thousand year regime reign supreme and stamp out the parasites suckling the life out of the earth like ticks on the flesh of Matka Rossiya.
This will also make eggs cheaper.
It blows my mind that pro- Palestinians think they shouldn’t support Ukraine.
I wonder if MLs around here are pro-Palestine only because that’s a pushback against the Western representation in the Middle East, Isreal
Yeah they have no issue with China helping Israel as long as sometimes the country says free palestine
I think you nailed it.
I think some of that stems from Zelensky holding Israel in favor a lot. He’s had multiple positive comments about it, even though Israel is doing what Russia did to Ukraine (or tried to do really)
His view on Israel has shifted considerably. I don’t blame him for trying to highlight the parallels to gain favor and cooperation immediately after October 7. Naturally he’s signaling, “Ah, you’re going through what we’ve been going through! Let’s work together!”
Though of course after months went on and Israel’s response became orders of magnitude more atrocious and russian-like than the attack itself, then Ukraine began distancing itself and even providing aid to Gaza.
Or when they say that Russia’s genocide of the Ukrainians or China’s genocide of the Uyghurs isn’t real and claiming it is real is actually genocide denialism?
/This is an actual image of .ml’s and dbzer0’s admins.Pretty accurate. However it is just braindead like @Flatworm7591@lemmy.dbzer0.com and @Luminous5481@lemmy.dbzer0.com
But as long as @db0@lemmy.dbzer0.com let’s them do whatever they want, he is part of the problem.
And they call themselves anarchists lol. Like someone who smoked weed once calls themselves hippie.
Edit: watch me get banned in real time from their hypocritical “Anarchist Flotilla”. I bet they all feel like heroes by using the term Flotilla
This sarcastic comment was removed and got me banned:
I see. So the US western expansion wasn’t imperialist because they weren’t a hegemonic world power yet. They were just trying to make sure they could stand up to England! It wasn’t about territorial expansion or resources at all. Ridiculous drivel.
They can’t let other tankies see how ridiculous their arguments are.
The other one was mocking tankies for gargling Putin’s asshole, which is a bit more understandable; I guess some people like the taste.
Tankies are authoritarians. Red fascists. They don’t give a fuck about anything or anyone, just their fascist kings being in charge so they can hurt people they think are inferior. Just like any other fascist.
They shit on Marx and gargle Lenin and Mao, then tell you that actually state control and secret police are the real communism.
Is it any wonder from people who cheer when the tanks roll over protesters and revolutionaries?
I am still convinced a sizable chunk of online tankies are just right-wing extremists cosplaying. Oh, and of course foreign operatives.
I’d say it’s even simpler than that, it’s just tribalism.
$person has criticized our gracious $monarch. They deserve to die!
$person speaks against $religion and is a heretic. They deserve to die!
$person made fun of $fascist_leader. They deserve to die!
$person goes against $party. They deserve to die!
Whoever is in power speaks absolute truth. Be it a fascist leader, a church, a communist party or a monarch. Opposing that truth is heresy/treason/counter-revolutionary/evil and should be severely punished.
I hate how much they made Marx’s name dirty, not only people will look at you funny for being communism because of the $$$ propaganda, they will also look at tankies and think communists are like this, infuriating
🤣 I enjoy refuting their bullshit about the USSR since I’m from there.
Don’t forget insulting your blood line while they are at it.
Oh that’s their only way of survival. Not by logic, but by banning anything going against their opinion.
It’s the same as if you would argue with a flatearther. Pure denialism.
Of course it’s imperialism.
What kinda irks me, as an American, is when other Americans act like this is the first time anyone’s done an invasion in the 21st century. As though our government didn’t spend the last twenty+ years establishing what huge economic, nuclear powers can get away with on the world stage.
commies can’t conquer. Every tankie knows this.
When a tankie says they’re not imperialist, they’re generally referring to the strict definition set forth by Lenin, and not the looser definition in common use.
You’ll get some online tankies who dick ride Russia for sure, but they’re just larping. Real Marxists, who do real organizing, are generally more discerning.
Don’t get me wrong though, I’m not supporting them. They intentionally misunderstand when people say imperialist just so they can argue Russia isn’t. No one is talking about the strict definition when they say it to a tankie.
I’m not familiar with Lenin’s particular definition of imperialism. Does it somehow exclude what Russia is doing?
If you want to understand fully how they decide imperialist vs not imperialist you’d have to read, imperialism: the highest stage of capitalism.
Really it comes down to finance and the export of capital. Lenin differentiated between finance and exporting capital, and wars of territorial aggression. What Russia is doing would fall under war of aggression and not strictly imperialism according to his definition.
https://www.struggle-la-lucha.org/2023/08/16/five-key-features-of-imperialism/
Honestly, that sounds like bullshit that Lenin made up so he could say he’s totally not the new tsar.
90% of what lenin says is bullshit to justify shit.
To be fair literally everyone with any real power though history does that. If your getting your definitions entirely from a dude self justify their own actions your a fucking idiot.
It’s only imperialism if it’s being produced in the special empire
If it doesn’t come from the regions of the Western Imperialist Pigs then it’s not real imperialism. It’s sparkling annexation.
You’re only being upvoted because people think you’re being sarcastic, but I know you’re being serious because I’ve seen you do this before.
No? I suspect you are talking about threads where I’ve been saying that the Russian-Ukranian war must be stopped, threads where I defended/explained some Putin’s talking points, and literally telling people that there’s no difference between deaths of Ukrainian civilians and Russian civilians, the fact that killing more Russians will not grant Ukraine victory. I also recall a few threads where I called out literal neonazis in Ukraine and got downvoted by Ukraine larping supporters from the left to hell.
I have never defended Putin’s expansionism and have always called it imperialism.
No, no,no, you must choose sides, good or bad, black or white.
No such thing as nuance or critical thinking on the internet, get with the program.So you’re against the war, but only when it means criticizing Ukraine?
Not full-strength kremlin propaganda then, just kremlin propaganda lite. Got it.
How about you tell everyone that the war could end in a day if Putin simply decides to pull his troops out of Ukraine? I don’t recall you ever mentioning that.
Oh, by the way, there’s a substantial difference between one or two collateral civilian casualties now and then, and deliberate targeting of civilians and civilian infrastructure, killing them in the thousands, as well as detaining, displacing, torturing, and raping them.
The fact that you try so hard to draw a false equivalence between the two, is itself kremlin propaganda.
The regime change already happened in 2014 tho
You see in the current geopolitical material situation it’s essential for Russia and China to be the counteraction to the US by doing the same and aligning on their shared goal of billionaire murder cult child fuckers exploiting all of humanity
Has it… Has it always been like this? Maybe it was there dormant, like cancer, that suddenly sprang metastases when conditions got ripe? Let it stew too long… You want to catch that early, nip in in the bud. You can’t easily get rid of it once it burrowed its tick head in there.
Sorry for meandering, just thinking out loud…
Does anyone know if molotov cocktails work as tick removers? How well and what dose, does anyone know? (no AI answers ples)
Where do you guys find these people?
Lemmy.ml/socialism is a toxic wasteland filled with Stalinists and DPRK supporters (really)
Right, would that be the only place? I can’t say I’ve seen any DPRK supporters like, ever. Maybe during that period where people began challenging US propaganda and understandably assumed it was all bullshit; that was like seven or eight years ago though.
They are everywhere but less impactful if you block some instances
I’m yet to see any really without seeking them out
I’ve really bumped into it by accident when browsing all and not noticing where I am. Then it’ll be a week of hate messages after a non consequential comment on something unimportant.
On lemmy.world often.
Every time someone posts about calling out ml bs they are like sharks to blood
I have certainly seen more posts like this than the posts it references, of which I could recall none
I’m mostly joking because of where the user is from. But they’re there. Hexbear and .ml are the communities you’ll find these people the most
Ahh I see
