- cross-posted to:
- technology@beehaw.org
- cross-posted to:
- technology@beehaw.org
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He also had a three-page handwritten manifesto that included grievances with the US healthcare system, a document that spoke to the suspect’s “motivation and mindset”, officials said.
Publish it then.
Deny that you know or even saw them. Defend them if they do get caught, through protest, fundraising, bail, etc. Depose those who put them in jail if they are sentenced.
He was carrying it around for absolutely no reason and for long enough to get caught with it? Bullshit, it’s manufactured evidence.
First thought that came to mind as well, it sounds very implausible for him to be carrying a manifesto.
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Ikr
Well, a YouTube account with the shooters name posted a video today titled “truth” which was basically saying that there were videos scheduled to be made public in the near future (presumably on the same account), which would speak to his motivations and mind set or something of the sort.
Instead of telling you about it, I would prefer to just link the video, but according to YouTube, the account associated with the YouTube channel has been removed, so you can believe me or not on this. the video was only up for about 4 hours and when I saw it, maybe 30 minutes before it was removed from YouTube, it had 10’s of thousands of views. I know those counters aren’t exactly real time, so it’s not unreasonable to think that upwards of 100k people saw it, maybe more, and unless one of them saved it, it’s likely that nobody else will see it.
It’s still here for now
This is fabricated
That may be so, but the claim in the context that the YouTube handle doesn’t match his Twitter handle is wrong
http://web.archive.org/web/20241209203920/https://www.youtube.com/@PepMangione
I’m not sure about the claim that the account was created yesterday. This article claims it was created in January, but I’m not sure if that can be verified now that the account has been removed
Lol, Twitter?! Seriously? I’m not even going to click that shit. I know it’s not real.
Pretty sure that YT account was faked, or mis-related to Mangione
It will be impossible to ever know whether or was or not.
Well well well,
Once, not if, but once it leaks, who ordered this, and who executed said order of this information being suppressed, you’ll have more heads in line for the guillotine.
¡Congrats!
That list is getting long.
This thing about a guy at Macdonald’s recognizing his eyes also sounds bit strange tbh
Or he consider himself a crusader for a cause more than a vigilante and was carrying it to get more attention to his beliefs.
And yet instead of waiting around to get lots of attention and people *quoting things he said before cops arrived he quietly got on a bus. Doesn’t track.
*fucking worthless autocorrect
My tin foil hat theory is that he was planning out another shooting and got interrupted.
They need dozens of psy PhD types to review it to asses risks and prep narratives to discredit him.
Get fucked, dude is a hero.
Give them time to write it up! They police are having problems with the shared Google Doc permissions.
and the reading, don’t forget the reading
Historically speaking, pigs can’t read.
Thatsthejoke.gif
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Wow thanks for posting
We wouldn’t want to arouse ill-will toward health insurers /s
Hey you got your account back!!
Are you referring to the 2FA problem I had? I brute-forced it with a simple Bash script utilizing Lemmy API. Our instance doesn’t seem to have rate-limiting.
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that is configurable by your admin. while it was useful for you, you should probably raise that problem to your admin.
Yea, Oh Cool.
Reported by a worker at McD. Wtf, they’re the group that would benefit the most from a change in the healthcare system. Idiot.
Reported by a worker at McD. Wtf, they’re the group that would benefit the most from a change in the healthcare system. Idiot.
Or, and hear me out here, we can view this with a little sympathy: there’s $60k in rewards for anyone who turned this guy in, and the person who did it makes peanuts at McDonalds.
Now, I don’t know if I would do it, but I can completely and utterly sympathize why someone who makes poverty wages would turn class traitor for what almost certainly life-changing money.
Well then this person is a moron. They won’t see a dime. Maybe a pat on the head and a gift card from the dollar store.
Employee of the Month
With the review bombing and public hatred of that McDonald’s location? Fired is more like it.
I don’t think that McDonald’s gives single fuck about review bombing
The corporation? Definitely not. But review bombing and boycotting will hurt the profits of that franchised location, and its owner certainly will.
Do people really look at or read reviews of McDonald’s?
You research reviews of McDonald where you are going to get burger? Really?
I meant more like, that’s the best accolade you may get as someone working for McDonald’s. But yes, McDonald’s absolutely has a reason to support the status quo in terms of corporate rule.
They’ll let him order anything he wants off the dollar menu!
Which is really just a pack of fries, minus the fries at this point, becaues what store has a dollar menu anymore?
No way the average person working at Mcdonalds does anything but blow 60k even if they get it.
Edit: To be clear, I spent 4 years working at one. Good people, bad people, but not much economic sophistication in either group.
Yeah, the fucking idiot will probably all blow it on something stupid like an ER visit.
I don’t. Might as well just be a cop if you think like that, plenty of room for bootlicking morons in that profession.
Here here. I’m poor as shit, got no insurance whatsoever, 60k would be somewhat life changing for me. I would never ever squeal on a comrade like that, even for millions.
Find out finds everyone
Way ahead of you.
that person might get 60k…
maybe because of this circle jerk, regime will pay out to prove a point.
but there is a lesson in this discussion folks.
The downvotes on this really make me question my faith in humanity.
Only the downvotes?
What about the cheering on of murder in the street?
To be charitable, other people can have different views on ethics.
For example, if harming a CEO who helped raise claim denial rates from less than 10% to 30% results in revised policies and less overall suffering, that could be morally justifable to some.
Vigilante justice indicates a failure in the system to administer justice.
It is absolutely in society’s interest that someone who has caused deaths and misery of thousands is punished.
Punished, sure, but not murdered.
Luigi wasn’t really in a position where he could stop the CEO through any lesser use of force.
And that’s because it’s not his job to do so. Not every problem needs to be solvable by any given individual.
If he really was that passionate about the problem, he should’ve run for office to get into a position to solve the problem, or at least joined forces with some group that pushes for causes he believes in. Or started a business to compete with those businesses he disagrees with. Those would all be proactive steps he could take. Killing a CEO doesn’t solve anything, another will take his place, and surely he knew that.
Are you advocating torture?
No, investigations by the various 3-letter agencies.
We have a president who says that he could do exactly what The Adjuster did, and get away with it. If the president can do it, why not this guy?
I don’t like it, but this is our world right now.
Hey DM, can I get a reroll?
The comment I replied to wasn’t cheering on a murderer.
The comment I replied to was trying to convey that an impoverished person may feel like the reward money for turning in a murderer outweighs any moralizing over the murder itself. That the dollar figure could be literally life changing and they may feel they have no option but to turn them in.
And people downvoted that. Hence my shaken faith in people’s ability to empathize.
I guess people are saying that they believe there is such a thing as an ethical murder in the streets. Of course in any form of ethics vacuum chamber this can’t stand. But in the real world where children are bombed for the sake of some asshole’s religion, where the president boasts he could get away with murder in the street and courts confirm this, in a world where sick people are left to suffer to boost a share price, then, THEN an act like this becomes a reasonable response to an unreasonable world.
Maybe someone better educated can tell me what ethics scholars have to say about how an ethical actor should behave in a system where ethics have utterly broken down. Right now, the crowd is saying “like that guy.”
I’m ill-disposed to wag my finger at them, and think the only ethical course is to address the corrupt environment in which this act occurred, because that environment undermines any one-dimensional ethical evaluation of this murder in the street, and that makes me deeply uncomfortable.
Neat how that works. Keep the populace poor and they become a wall to wall surveillance system for you. And people worry about technology…
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shooter and ceo were closer in class than the shooter and working class
Ah, good ol’ “anyone who makes enough money to pay rent is part of the capitalist class, not the working class”
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He was a white collar working class guy. His work history is full of positions at various tech companies working as an engineer. It doesn’t appear that he was handed any sort of dynasty.
He was upper class, and he had better opportunities than your average American, but he was still a worker.
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Some people think anyone whose parents actually owned a house are “the elites”.
No. The CEO earned more in a year than even someone with a six figure salary would earn in a lifetime.
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And yet, despite that was still responsible for less deaths than the CEO
Maybe his family did, but judging by his work history, he wasn’t personally wealthy enough to be owning a country club.
If he was “owns a country club” rich, his work history would mostly just say “Owner and CEO of whatever country club”.
There’s no reason to work any sort of normal job if you have that kind of income rolling in.
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Could well be in debt up to their eyeballs and barely making a profit, for all we know.
I dunno. I’ve never met the narc, and I already don’t feel like he’s on my side.
Off-topic question: are rewards money taxable?
There’s no reason for them not to be treated like any other income.
If I remember correctly, they can be anonymous. If that’s the case, they wouldn’t really be easily taxable. Still, we are talking about the government here, and if they tax lottery winnings, I would bet they tax rewards.
Simply a lack of class consciousness. America has worked hard since the rise of the USSR to topple workers power through union busting and destruction of community.
Basically we are built by our material conditions.
One doesn’t have to go far to find a boot-licking class traitor who thinks if they run the rat race well enough they’ll get a piece of cheese.
But to be fair to the McDonalds worker, the cash reward is designed to do just that.
$50k is 1-2 years pay for the person who reported him. For them, that short term relief was worth more than the highly improbable outcome where this man’s actions actually impact their life in a positive way in the next few months. Money wins almost every time
I’m glad the rat will most likely get denied their pellet.
Idiot yes but we can’t be too harsh on the pedon… so much education needs to be done, and these recent events is a good time for outreach and education.
Unity is the message. Luigi did the hard work, least the plebs can do it show some solidarity.
We can’t tell you who squealed, but it was one of the dozen employees at this McDonald’s. Probably the one that’s going to change jobs soon…
I’d be pissed and scared if I was an employee at that McDonald’s
Because they rely on “tips” , as the corporation is unable to pay a wage that is sufficient to support a basic standard of living. If only capitalist weren’t so greedy they wouldn’t be relying on the tips to survive.
I worked at McDonalds for a few years when I was younger. They didn’t let us get tips.
Also worked there. There is no McDonald’s that has ever allowed tips. It’s against their corporate rules. I even saw an employee get written up for accepting a tip, once.
America’s working class has a long history of buying into propaganda and acting against their own interests. It’s a huge reason why the medical industry has gotten so bad.
That being said, it’s important to keep our anger focused on the system, not people who are getting suckered by it.
It pains me to see so many people ready and willing to beat up their Trump voting neighbor who fell for propaganda designed for them but not the Trump financing ceos
He had everything on him to get caught and convicted. I don’t think he wanted to run forever.
Jokes on you if you think this is going to change anything
Oh look, something changed: https://amp.cnn.com/cnn/2024/12/05/health/anthem-blue-cross-blue-shield-anesthesia-claim-limits
Oh look, nothing relevant changed. Looks like my comment still stands.
Here you are saying the actions of people don’t have meaning. You feel smug because you proved yourself right. Seems the only power you have here is convincing others they are as powerless as you.
Need those goalposts moved again? I’d be happy to do it for you for $20.
Don’t need to move goal posts when nothing has changed. Get back to me with a relevant story.
Meanwhile people are still dying because of claims being denied, which you know, is the whole point of this story, or “goal post”.
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Somebody better nullify that jury.
It only takes of working man to get on it to make it flop
And here’s your 12 jury members…
Oh, it’s Mark Cuban, Mark Zuckerburg, Jeff Bezos, Elon Musk, Bill Gates, Rupert Murdoch,
…I could keep this joke going if I used google, but is it sad that I could name 6 people by memory just by using the parameters “Rich asshole who would have no empathy for the general public, and would absolutely convict”?
it would have to be 12 CEOs but they deff aint got to be proper owner oligarch… just scrape some middling f500 roaster with some “nonames”
but yes valid point… but defense can generally strike some of these.
this guy going to need proper counsel, I am assuming fun raising won’t be an issue. he deserves the best.
coupled with proper PR campaign on socials since TV will try to destroy him.
this jury must not convict because the glove don’t fit hehe
Plenty of lawyers, at least some of them talented, will offer to defend him for free.
It could make their career.
defense of this scale will require several million dollars, nobody will do that for free.
also, defending this guy will make you enemy of the owner class. top talent will opt out.
I could name 6 people by memory just by using the parameters "Rich asshole who would have no empathy for the general pub
You should find more about gates than the name
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bill_%26_Melinda_Gates_Foundation
I’m fairly certain they’ll just find a new jury
Sure sounds like justice.
we gonna keep trying until we win…
tbh that is the ruling class MO tho
I mean… it does seem pretty fair? If the jury is hung it’s up to the state to retry. If the jury comes back not guilty then that’s the end of it.
Fortunately in criminal trials if the Jury can return a not guilty verdict, that’s game over for the states case. Double jeopardy they can’t retry.
Now if one guy on the Jury opposes a guilty verdict, and no verdict is reached, then the state can retry.
They could also go after him with Thompson’s family in civil suit to destroy him financially, which it turns out is not double jeopardy
Lol … I thought you were asking to nudify the jury
Why do I keep reading his name as “Luigi’s Mansion”
Lucky the police got him before he got nintendo’ed.
There’s a picture of him holding a McD happy meal?? He had the gun and manifesto just laying there in his backpack? You f’ing kidding??
Some elite fucks used an advanced AI search algorithm to search a bunch of people who vaguely looked like him. Input term search for social media and ‘reviews’ to further narrow down until you find someone who has a few tweets and posts that the media can point to say “yup hey look, he liked Kzynski’s manifesto on goodreads…got the guy!”. Plant evidence, and you got your scapegoat.
This poor kids’ life is ruined. And he will probably be threatened if he doesn’t plead guilty and waive jury trial. He’ll get a visit from the MIB threatening to skin his family alive in front of him if he doesn’t play along.
Reading these fantasy takes is exhausting. It’s hard to want to be a part of a community that supports this guy by gaslighting everyone, saying things like “it’s not the same guy in the four photos!” Just hundreds of people all convinced they can secure this guys freedom by acting dumb and face blind- you’ve created a whole fictional scenario here that’s just unbelievable and unrealistic.
If he didn’t want to get caught he shouldn’t have left DNA all over, shouldn’t have taken off his mask, shouldn’t be carrying the murder weapon days later… He could have helped himself but instead there’s an army of idiots who are probably just creating this fan fiction to impress their peers. It’s very childish though. This guy tried to do something which is commendable, or maybe he’s just mentally ill, but I’m just tired of reading all this nonsense. Who are you signalling to?
I posted this elsewhere, but this is one of the few times I buy the conspiracy theory, not the official story.
Dude pulls off a targeted assassination, gets away clean, trolls the cops with a bag of monopoly money, gets out of the state, stays essentially hidden for almost a week… And then gets clocked by some poor maccas employee and gets taken in with a manifesto AND a gun on his person?
It’s the nazi flag and 3 copies of The Sims all over again, except this time the folks doing it are slightly more competent and actually pulled it off.
This case is so important, so high profile, that they just need to arrest someone ASAP. Anyone. And that person is not in for a good time.
There’s a simple explanation: He wanted to keep on the move, and he wanted to be able to take down other targets.
smh that doesn’t fit the narrative
His face jas been plastered everywhere for the past week. My YouTube home page literally had 3-4 thumbnails of his face on every reload. Lemmy…X…news sites…massive exposure.
So yah…some random worker notices his face looks kind of similar while he’s dining at his favorite spot and bam. Don’t forget there was a $10k bounty, plenty of fast food workers might be itching to collect on something like that.
He probably figured once he was questioned about anything that they’d eventually get him so he prepared for that scenario. Or maybe this wasn’t even his last stop on his triple-D tour so he was still geared up.
We’ll see him in court. If he’s innocent then he make a pretty good argument and then we can decide whether to raise eyebrows but this all just seems Q-anon levels of silly right now.
To be fair, people were posting actors who look like the very shitty pictures we have of the guy too, and I buy some of them. Honestly, the picture we have looks more like Timothée Chalamet than this guy. I’m not saying it isn’t this guy, or it is Chalamet, but there’s a shit ton of people in this world, and a lot look like the shooter.
Edit to add: I’ll never trust the word of the authorities. They have to prove that this is the man. It’s their duty, not ours.
If you look at a photo of the guy taken from above him, so a similar angle to the surveillance camera, he looks very similar. I do think it’s him.
If you will not trust authorities how do you expect them to prove it to you?
They’re going to have to take it to court and provide evidence. Trust is what you give to someone without the need for evidence. If they can prove it, then sure I’ll believe it. I’m not just going to trust that they’re correct without that though.
Is there a reason to think there will be no trial and this guy by some reason will end up in some CIA black site without trial?
I just find it interesting that someone who has absolutely no trust in authorities does not have a theory that court can be influenced by the same authorities.
end up in some CIA black site without trial?
No, he’d end up Epsteined. If the evidence were a plant, he’d be of no use to them alive.
Trusting the authorities is absofuckinglutely the dumbest motherfucking take anyone can have in this capitalistic hellscape.
Even if they proved it was him it doesn’t matter. When OJ was acquitted, Jurors admitted they did it as a fuck you to the LAPD and justice system.
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unless you’ve worked in my field, which I can say with near certainty you haven’t, then you haven’t seen, witnessed, or experienced the things I have
I’ll bite, what field are you in?
I hope mental healthcare, but on the receiving end
Body guard or the person that watches flagged videos.
It reminds me of people in the UFO community.
The fantasy takes are so close to the people that still believe GameStop and AMC will still have a short squeeze.
I think he knew he was going to get caught. Words on bullets, monopoly money… It’s trying to make the story larger and larger. Pretty sure he will make a show in front of the jury.
I don’t know if that will work, but I respect that more than he killed the pig without making clear why.
You can’t convince me this is the real shooter, this guy looks more like Skeet from Jimmy Neutron than the “Grin Reaper” in the now famous pic
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What would “the elites” stand to gain from framing this dude, while the actual killer is still on the loose?
This is pretty unhinged, to be honest.
to make an example of someone to try to dissuade others from following in his footsteps
By sending him to prison?
That’s not really telling people anything they didn’t already know.
The killer is not as dangerous as the approval for his act. The government wants to prevent copycat vigilantes by making an example out of him. Regardless whether this guy is guilty or not, they’ll drag him through the deepest mud and then string him up with the harshest possible sentence, to discourage others from gunning down CEOs.
I very much doubt the possibility of going to prison will deter someone pissed off enough to kill someone.
I’m not adopting the conspiracy here, but if they can’t find the shooter with the whole country getting behind him, then they would want the optics of finding the shooter. Which could backfire, of course. It would be very telling, for example, if the cops got real confident about it and then the real shooter made some kind of public display with the false shooter in custody.
This was my thought process, too. If they got a framed guy here, the actual CEO killer would likely or hopefully do something else to let the public know that they were still out there.
Yeah, thats part of the reason I don’t buy it. If the actual killer acts again, it will be very embarrassing for the police.
They gain by preventing copycat killers. If other poors think that he got away with it, they might think they can, too.
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Yeah, I get that. However, the optics of having a successful “martyr” symbol is very, very dangerous. A wide scope of narrative means difficult to control. Difficult to control introduces “motivator to action” symbols among a, I think, specific (and quite populous) demographic (think of all the young males with zero purpose, waiting to seize on an opportunity for a real life Mr Robot, for example)… “well if he could do it, get away with it, AND become a ’hero’, what’s stopping me from doing the same?”
Having someone, anyone, buys time to craft the narrative and gauge public sentiment and, most importantly, dampen the probability of a revolutionary ’spark’ if you will.
Obviously we don’t have enough information here. It very well could be the dude they have in custody. I am only sharing one possible theory based off my experience and observations. And there are a number of very suspect observations here that are in line with narrative management.
I think the actual truth is, this guy isn’t a criminal mastermind, and he got caught.
He also looks a lot like the surveillance photo.
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On the upside, some people were pointing out he comes from a rich family
Not rich, but reasonably well off.
He was an ivy league grad, vacations in Bali, and his family owns a country club and a chain of nursing homes. He almost certainly has more money than the guy he shot.
You think that a lone assailant had more money than the CEO of one of two branches of the 9th largest company in the world by revenue and largest health insurance company in the US? And if so, why wouldn’t he have hired a hitman with all that money instead? Or just paid for medical bills out of pocket? Or just had his own doctor that only served him and prescribed whatever he wanted?
He was CEO, not founder. The dude was only worth around $50 million. The shooters family owns a country club and an entire chain of nursing homes. They almost certainly have more money, probably a lot more money.
I can’t answer your other questions. Perhaps the answers will be in his manifesto.
No way that he personally had more money than the CEO, from just looking at his work history. Maybe his whole family has more money than the CEO, but if we compared whole families against each other, the CEOs family would still come out on top.
We should spend the next year blanketing NY with information about jury nullification.
100% agreed. Might I recomend making https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uqH_Y1TupoQ go as viral as possible.
I like that, but there is a major problem with it, and it’s around 2:49 in the video:
Do you have any beliefs that might prevent you from making a decision based strictly on the law?
Grey suggests that saying “No” with intent to nullify is lying, and therefore perjury. He is wrong. Where legislated law and constitutional law come into conflict (and they do in all cases of nullification), it is your duty to strictly follow constitutional law. You must judge the case as a layperson. You are constitutionally obligated to follow your own sense of rationality. That means if legislated law provides an undesirable outcome, you are obligated to “strictly follow [constitutional] law”, and refuse to convict under a lower law.
I can honestly claim to have no beliefs that would prevent me from making a decision based strictly on the law. The 6th Amendment is part of the law, and the 6th amendment requires and empowers me (as a juror) to make whatever decision I determine is appropriate.
My reply would be: “if the law is just, I will make a decision that serves justice”.
And they would respond “You are excused, with our thanks”.
Don’t get creative. The only correct answer is “no”.
I had half a day to think about it when they were selecting jury for a DUI case. I’d rather speak my mind freely for the jurors they’ve already selected, who are present during the full selection process. Normally one might think context doesn’t matter but DUI laws can also apply to a bicycle, which is a perfect candidate for being nullified by the jury.
Earlier in the video he stated that the jurors cannot be punished for their decision, this applies if the outcome results in perjury.
We aren’t talking about the decision. We are talking about voir dire. You certainly can be charged and convicted of perjury if you lie during voir dire.
But again: it is not a lie to remember that the 6th Amendment right to a trial by jury of peers (as opposed to professional jurists) is constitutional law. It supersedes any legislated law, or any directive provided by any court. I hold no beliefs that might prevent me from making a decision strictly in accordance with the law.
We are talking about voir dire.
Wait, that isn’t just a term from “My Cousin Vinny”‽
This better not be a rickroll…
Careful, in case you haven’t heard, discussing jury nullification is apparently against the rules of lemmy.world. SMH (at lemmy.world admins).
The pinned post on lemmy.world right now clarifies that discussing jury nullification for crimes that have already happened, such as this, is perfectly acceptable. It’s only discussing it with respect to crimes which have not yet been committed which is against the TOS.
Wait, we got a Future Crimes Division? I didn’t know .world was run by a bunch of milky precogs…
If you plan some violence and include jury nullification as some viable part of the plan, and publish that shit online, not only is it kind of useless and lousy opsec, but it will attract heat that is unwanted and unnecessary. It’s literally a conspiracy to undermine nullification at that point, like a false flag. So no, don’t do that, and I back the mods on this.
I didn’t
If you trust them after having enforced an unwritten policy and still not allowing discussion of something that’s perfectly legal.
I do. They’re cool.
What the Multivac?!
They are certainly empowered to do that, just as I am empowered to block any instance I don’t want to participate in. If they are not tolerant and respectful of my beliefs (even if they don’t share them) then I don’t want to contribute to their community either.
Layperson juries are a fundamental component of criminal justice. The law exists to serve the people, not the lawyers, not the government. Rejecting jurors for understanding the purpose of having a layperson jury fundamentally violates the rights of the accused in particular, and society in general.
One of us
So you’re a killer?
I kill bugs all day long.
One of us.
Him… Him, that guy, him, that dude, me, this guy, that guy over there, the dude next to him, the guy by the bathrooms, and the line beside it, the lady by the punchbowl, I don’t know the pronoun of the dj, but I heard them agree as well.
Of all the people, it happened to be someone who likely uses lemmy.
wait…there’s only like a thousand of us !
We are all Luigi.
Forever Player 2.
Huh?
I almost explained that, then read your username…
I am Luigi
I am Luigi.
No, i am Luigi!
I’m Luigi and so’s my wife
I am
Sparticus! Errr…Luigi!brb naming my newborn Luigi
can confirm… this guys wife wants me to call her Luigi
How awesome would it be if it turned out to be no poop guy??!
For the uninitiated: https://web.archive.org/web/20230624223444/https://lemmy.world/post/440073
…I’m sorry, what? No poop guy?
Last summer there was a guy asking for advice on not popping for 3 days.
…that explaination only raises MORE questions!
And that sums up the whole poop ordeal.
Doesn’t look like the guy in the photos. That guy had a coat on. Not guilty.
He honestly doesn’t look like the same guy to me. Idk.
I admit I’m kinda disappointed. He pulled out almost perfect assassination that looked well thought out, managed to get away with only a few hickups in his plan as far as his face is considered, and then walks around with a murder weapon and a manifesto in his bag? Shame, really. All he needed was to lay low for a while, grow a beard and he’d probably be OK.
Don’t be disappointed. I guessed he was going to do this, and for good reason. His options were to either, live a life in fear, worrying that one day he would be caught, or, to basically give him self up, and elect for a Jury trial. Jury nullification is one os the most powerful tools available to the average, non-rich american. If he goes through the trial and gets acquited (which only takes 1 juror), then hes a free man, a folk hero, and he sets the precident that killing rich murderers isn’t an automatic crime.
What he’s doing is the smartest available option, please donate to his legal defense fund.
and gets acquited (which only takes 1 juror)
Unfortunately this is not true. 1 juror alone can hang the jury, but they’d have to convince all the other jurors to actually render a verdict of not guilty to avoid a mistrial
Have you ever been on a jury? In my experience it’s 2-4 strong personalities and a bunch of people confused by lawyer speak (because two confident authority figures are telling them to believe e two different things and they can’t reconcile the contradiction) and people who just want to go home and thus go along with the strong personalities.
Isn’t it always said that jurys are made up of people not smart enough to get out of jury duty.
Some jobs give you your work day wage for jury duty as a benefit. Why not go? Get paid by work to take a break from work and watch live court drama.
There’s value in knowing how it works.
If your job doesn’t pay you, the $15/day, or whatever ridiculous amount, won’t pay your bills so yes, get out of it.
… Right, so therefore
1 juror alone can hang the jury, but they’d have to convince all the other jurors to actually render a verdict of not guilty to avoid a mistrial
a court case also draws out media coverage, possibly more than an extended search would
I almost want to believe this guy saw how similar he was to the photos and how famous the shooter was getting and decided to take the fall by wandering around in public with some incriminating circumstantial evidence until someone reported him so he could take the credit.
You’re supposed to grow the beard before and shave it off after. Its much faster to shave it off than grow it back
As a girl, shit.
No worries gurl, you can still use a wig and fake beard
You don’t understand.
The fact that he wrote a manifesto meant he wanted to get caught. The taking the murder weapon and the manifesto to the McDonald’s was his way of saying he had gotten bored waiting for the cops to catch him. He pretty much turned himself in.
For sure this has not been planted at all.
Only a bit more subtle than Russians https://www.vice.com/en/article/russia-sims-3/
The gun is planted. They just found a crazy guy in order to convince everyone that they actually found the culprit.
To my knowledge, he claimed specifically the money in his bag was planted. Specifically they said there was US and foreign cash in his bag. The fact that Luigi is denying the cash but admitting to the gun and manifesto. To me I think he knew he was going down… but I would be far from supprised if the money was planted either to raise it up to 1st degree murder… or while I’m very far from legally qualified… if they could try and claim he was doing a job for an enemy of the US, could they buypass the trial?
I find that kind of unlikely. If they wanted to frame someone just to have a killer, they wouldn’t be talking about a “3D printed ghost gun”, but just use a regular gun. I, for one, haven’t known that it’s possible to 3D print a pretty well working, and silenced, gun. And that might inspire someone - acquiring weapons is the harder part of any such murder, assuming you don’t want to get caught, and the fact that you can get it without anyone knowing about it makes it way easier.
They know the guy is a engineer. They came up with the 3D printed gun because it fits with the character, and gives politician an excuse to ban 3D printers all together, “for our safety!”.
I’m speculating and being a conspiracy theory, but in theory this could make sense. Nobody will ever find out the truth, I’m afraid.
If they did that and the real killer killed again, what would that achieve? Or is this a one-and-done thing?
Not that I’m fully on board with the theory, but you might be surprised how often “solving” a high profile case is placed above actually getting the right man.
This is a publicity nightmare for the police, and getting someone in custody “achieves” placating the public and key stakeholders.
Repeating things about this kids views on the Uni-bomber and referring to his writings as a manifesto “achieves” diminishing his status as a folk hero.
So while I won’t endorse any particular theory until more evidence comes out, it wouldn’t be the first time putting a scapegoat in jail was deemed more important than letting people think the “perp” got away. Even if the hypothetical real shooter kills again, controlling the narrative can be it’s own goal in cases like this.
If they did that and the real killer killed again, what would that achieve?
More dead CEOs, I guess. I’m down with that.
I doubt you will be when the costs of everything go up due to all the corporations hiring massive security teams.
Something that doesn’t seem to occur to so many of you and something most of you have no response to. In fact, the only response I occasionally get is that it’s worth the cost, which seems to go against the whole reason for the assassination in the first place.
How much do you think it costs to hire a security detail? I’m pretty sure security for the entire C-suite would be a tiny drop in the bucket for most mega-corporations.
Whether it costs a dollar or a billion dollars, who do you think is going to pay for it?
If they could squeeze out an extra dollar then they would already do so. They don’t need to justify it as “increased security costs”.
I think this is why there’s a common narrative on the internet that this “evidence” was planted to frame a random dude.
It’s fair to call that a conspiracy theory at this point, but hopefully due process will reveal the truth.
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The article spelled Hero wrong…
I’m curious why he still carry all those things after he is done with it.
Check out parallel construction concept…
He didn’t… They found where he dispose of it and gave to police to plant on him so we have to accept he is the perp…
You can get creative with who “they” are here btw
BC if you got murdered they would never do this.
Also he left a dead man switch for YouTube upload.
Proof of YouTube upload?
There’s no proof. Yet.
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Maybe plotting how to dispose of it, perhaps extra paranoid with how much he blew up. Unfortunately all the memes of him probably helped spread the search for him. Not everyone who saw a meme agreed with his actions.
It was a ghost gun, he could have thrown it into any ditch and not have it traced back to him.
He’d probably be ditching more than just that. He could be caught on a security camera disposing of it which could give further clues. He may also had no intention of disposal and intended to keep the firearm.
There are not security cameras all the way.
He may also had no intention of disposal
The whole point of a ghost gun is to be able to throw it away and have it not traced back to you.
Private security footage could have caught him disposing, someone could have witnessess and grabbed another photo of him using his their cell phone. He could be worried about finger prints on the gun or other biological clues. And if a ghost gun is so untraceable, keeping it after a crime shouldn’t be proof, because how do you prove it was this ghost gun used in the crime? He could claim he just keeps it for self defense or was interested in how far 3D printed tech has come
He could be planning another assassination or desire to keep the weapon for self defense purposes. I think you are downplaying the parannoia that would come with such a large scale manhunt accompanied with becoming an internet meme spreading your photo and awareness of your act over night. Paranoia makes you constantly think “but what if?” And that paranoia is even stronger in an extreme circumstance like this.
The fact is, we may never know why he kept it.
Even without serial number, a ghost gun will leave rifling marks on the bullets which can be compared by firing the gun into ballistic gel
Sad reality and a lessons on you didn’t see shit.
In other threads, people have suggested that he might be carrying the manifesto in case he was shot and killed if/when arrested.
Possibly, yes. I’m amazed he still had the gun though.
Well I’d say… could it also be plausible he was going for another CEO.
Actually, that wouldn’t surprise me at all.
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Raise your hand if you want to read the suspect’s manifesto!
I doubt they will release it if has any teeth…
They’d have to if they wanna use it as evidence.
in 2 years for the court proceeding?
2 years?
Edit: speedy trials are the burden of the defense. Prosecution/plantiffs have more restrictions. I’m not too sure how New York specifically operates
they will waste all the time they can while mentally and physically abusing him in the system…
have a look at this guy’s twitter: https://x.com/pepmangione?lang=en
Can you screenshot it? I’m not signing up for that shithole site.
You know, is said he worked UI at Firaxia from '15 to '17, which first made me think he worked on Civ VI, but then more likely Xcom Chimera Squad?
You don’t get that job without having some interest in games. I hope it turns out he actually played Assassin’s Creed and is intentionally pulling an Ezio look, smile and all.
I read in an AP article that he worked on Civ VI as an intern, so you would be correct.
He started a game dev club at his uni iirc
