• anarchiddy@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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    6 months ago

    I had my energy company remove their LVTC smart meter this week after they started using it to shut off our condenser unit during our 100 degree days

    The fact that it exists at all is bad enough, but they were doing this at a time when our AC was already malfunctioning due to low refrigerant. On the day they first shut it off, our house reached 94 degrees.

    The program that the previous owner signed up for that enabled them to do this gave them a fucking two dollar a month discount.

    I use a smart thermostat to optimize my home conditioning - having a second meter fucking with my schedule ends up making us all miserable. Energy providers need to stop fucking around and just build out their infrastructure to handle worst case peak loads, and enable customers to install solar to reduce peak loading to begin with.

    The other thing that kills me about this is that our provider administers our city’s solar electric subsidy program themselves. When i had them come out to give us a quote, they inflated their price by more than 100% because they knew what our electricity bill was. All they did was take our average monthly bill and multiplied it by the repayment period. I could have been providing them more energy to the grid at their peak load if they hadn’t tried scamming me.

    FUCK private energy providers.

    • illusionist@lemmy.zip
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      6 months ago

      Peak load of households is not during peak solar power generation. Households installing pv isn’t a solution to what you described.

      Today, you could also use a battery to buy power during mid day and use it in the evening when you need it the most.

      • anarchiddy@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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        6 months ago

        In moderate climates in the US, peak loads are typically the hottest and sunniest hours of the day since condenser units are the most energy-hungry appliance in most homes. Clouds notwithstanding, peak solar generation would typically align (or closely align) with peak load time.

        Batteries would also help a lot - they should definitely be subsidizing the installation of those as well but unfortunately they aren’t yet (at least not in my state).

        • ayyy@sh.itjust.works
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          6 months ago

          This is incorrect. Look up the “duck curve” or if you prefer real-world examples look at the California electricity market (CAISO) where they have an excellent “net demand curve” that illustrates the problem.

          • anarchiddy@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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            6 months ago

            This curve has changed somewhat since this study in 2016. More efficient home insulation, remote working, and energy-efficient cooling systems have large impact in this pattern. But assuming you have a well-insulated home, setting your thermostat to maintain a consistent temperature throughout the day will shift this peak earlier and lower the peak load at sunset, when many people are returning home. More efficient heat pumps with variable pressure capabilities also helps this a lot, too.

            Given just how many variables are involved, it’s better to assume peak cooling load to be mid-day and work toward equalizing that curve, rather than reacting to transient patterns that are subject to changes in customer behavior. Solar installations are just one aspect of this mitigation strategy, along with energy storage, energy-efficient cooling systems, and more efficient insulation and solar heat gain mitigation strategies.

            If we’re discussing infrastructure improvements we might as well discuss home efficiency improvements as well.

              • anarchiddy@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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                6 months ago

                I’m not really saying that the curve itself is changing (sorry, I was really not clear), only that those other variables reduce actual energy demand later in the day because of the efficiency gains and thermal banking that happens during the peak energy production. The overproduction during max solar hours is still a problem. Even if the utility doesn’t have a way of banking the extra supply, individual customers can do it themselves at a smaller scale, even if just by over-cooling their homes to reduce their demand after sundown.

                Overall, the problem of the duck curve isn’t as much about maxing out the grid, it’s about the utility not having instantaneous power availability when the sun suddenly goes down. For people like me who work from home and have the flexibility to keep my home cool enough to need less cooling in the evening, having solar power means I can take advantage of that free energy and bank it to reduce my demand in the evening.

                I get what you were saying now, but having solar would absolutely reduce my demand during peak hours.

              • anarchiddy@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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                6 months ago

                Ok now go just one step further and ask yourself what variables factor into this.

                There’s a reason that pattern exists, and it isn’t because solar and cooling hours don’t align.

                • sqw@lemmy.sdf.org
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                  6 months ago

                  the difference between demand and net demand in that graph is purely solar/wind generation, isn’t it?

        • illusionist@lemmy.zip
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          6 months ago

          Why do you want a subsidy for batteries? Installing batteries at a large scale at homes is incredibly expensive compared to an off site battery. Especially with regards to the move towards hydrogen.

          • anarchiddy@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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            6 months ago

            For the same reason we want to subsidize solar production in residential construction even though it’s more efficient and cost-productive to do it at-scale. Having energy production and storage at the point of use reduces strain on power infrastructure and helps alleviate the types of load surging ayyy is talking about.

            It’s not a replacement for modernizing our power grids, too - it simply helps to make them more resilient.

            • illusionist@lemmy.zip
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              6 months ago

              That’s understandable but do we need it now? Neither pv nor batteries last forever. I’m just not sure if we need them now (or short-medium term future). But I’m not in the position to decide upon it

    • Serinus@lemmy.world
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      6 months ago

      our city’s solar electric subsidy program

      It sounds like there’s two different things there. There’s a solar installation (hardware, etc.), and there’s likely some kind of net metering program (where they pay you or give you credit for electricity you generate). That paragraph sounds like the first, but the phrase sounds like the second.

      You shouldn’t have to go through them for the solar installation, if your conditions accommodate it. Granted, the conditions don’t apply to everyone. You’ll want to have a suitable roof that ideally faces south-ish, own your home, and plan to stay there for at least 10 years. In the US, you also kind of need to get it done within this calendar year, which is a rough ask, before the federal 30% tax credit goes away. But maybe you can find an installer that isn’t trying to scam you quite as much.

      (It’s early and cloudy today.)

      Solar system stats, Home Assistant panel

      • anarchiddy@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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        6 months ago

        Sorry, maybe I wasn’t being clear.

        My area has solar incentive programs that are run through the energy utility - meaning the state makes available zero-interest loans for the purposes of solar installation, but those loans are only available through an entity partnered with our utility. They limit the number of homes in each area that are eligible through this program so that solar generation never exceeds demand. Our home was eligible through the program, so I had them come out to give us a quote. Our utility is also transitioning to surge pricing and smart metering, so there’s a pretty high demand for solar installation in my area and they know that they’d lose out on a lot of revenue if everyone installed their own solar systems.

        A part of that process was them asking for the last year of energy bills, along with taking measurements and doing daylighting analysis on our roof area. At the end, they gave us a quote for a 15 year loan for the equipment and installation, and it just so happened that the monthly payment was the same as our average energy bill. I work in AEC and I know what solar panels cost, and they had inflated their price by more than double what it would cost at market rate.

        Of course I could install my own panels, but it would be out-of-pocket and I would have to seek out and apply for out-of-state incentive programs myself, but I can’t afford the up-front costs and the loan terms don’t make sense for how long we’ll be in this house. Id love nothing more than to do it myself, even at a loss if that’s what it took, but I have a spouse that is less spiteful than I am.

        • Serinus@lemmy.world
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          6 months ago

          more than double what it would cost at market rate

          I definitely paid more for labor than for materials. My payoff time is about 13 years with a Tesla Powerwall 3, maybe a bit less now that I have an EV. I had a team of 4 guys plus an electrician here for about five days.

          I did go with a slightly more reputable company that charged slightly more, but I would have gone elsewhere if it was a huge difference.

          Maybe I should get around to making a post in !Solarpunk@slrpnk.net or something, even though it isn’t very punk.

          • anarchiddy@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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            6 months ago

            I’m factoring in labor. It was an extremely bad deal - they were praying on the fact most home owners do not have familiarity with solar installation pricing.

            Like I said, I would love to still do it on my own, but it just doesn’t make sense for our household.

      • aeiou_ckr@lemmy.world
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        6 months ago

        Your HA dashboard derailed this conversation for me. lol.

        I would love to know more about the equipment you are using to push this info into your HA.

  • some_guy@lemmy.sdf.org
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    6 months ago

    Yeah, that thing that nobody wanted? Everybody has to have it. Fuck corporations and capitalism.

    • bridgeenjoyer@sh.itjust.works
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      6 months ago

      Just like screens in cars, and MASSIVE trucks. We don’t want this. Well, some dumbass Americans do, but intelligent people don’t need a 32 ton 6 wheel drive pickup to haul jr to soccer.

      • Madzielle@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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        6 months ago

        Massive trucks? They need those trucks for truck stuff, like this giant dilhole parking with his wife to go to Aldi today. Not even a flag on the end of that ladder, it filled a whole spot by itself.

        My couch wouldn’t fit in that bed, and every giant truck I see is sparkling shiny and looks like it hasn’t done a day of hard labor, much like the drivers.

      • Schadrach@lemmy.sdf.org
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        6 months ago

        You underestimate the number of people you wouldn’t class as intelligent. If no one wanted massive trucks, they would have disappeared off the market within a couple of years because they wouldn’t sell. They’re ridiculous, inefficient hulks that basically no one really needs but they sell, so they continue being made.

        • moakley@lemmy.world
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          6 months ago

          It’s actually because small trucks were regulated out of the US market. Smaller vehicles have more stringent mileage standards that trucks aren’t able to meet. That forces companies to make all their trucks bigger, because bigger vehicles are held to a different standard.

          So the people who want or need a truck are pushed to buy a larger one.

          • 5too@lemmy.world
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            6 months ago

            They can meet them. But the profit margin is slimmer than if they use the giant frame.

      • Tlaloc_Temporal@lemmy.ca
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        6 months ago

        Do the new models even have non-“smart” fittings? I thought all the electronic chip plants closed during covid.

  • merc@sh.itjust.works
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    6 months ago

    Worse is Google that insists on shoving a terrible AI-based result in your face every time you do a search, with no way to turn it off.

    I’m not telling these systems to generate images of cow-like girls, but I’m getting AI shoved in my face all the time whether I want it or not. (I don’t).

    • jjmoldy@lemmy.world
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      6 months ago

      I am trying to understand what Google’s motivation for this even is. Surely it is not profitable to be replacing their existing, highly lucrative product with an inferior alternative that eats up way more power?

      • AA5B@lemmy.world
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        6 months ago

        Their motivation is always ads. The ai response is longer and takes time to read so more time looking at their ads. If the answer is sufficient, you might not even click away to the search result.

        AI is a potential huge bonanza to search sites, letting them suck up the ad revenue that used to goto the search results

      • Don_alForno@feddit.org
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        6 months ago

        They don’t want to direct you to the thing you’re searching for anymore because that means you’re off their site quickly. Instead they want to provide themselves whatever it is you were searching for, so you will stay on their site and generate ad money. They don’t care if their results are bad, because that just means you’ll stick around longer, looking for an answer.

      • WanderingThoughts@europe.pub
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        6 months ago

        To make search more lucrative, they’ve enshitified it and went too far, but for a short time there were great quarterly resukts. Now they’re slowly losing users. So they try AI to fix it up.

        It’s also a signal to the shareholders that they’re implementing the latest buzzword, plus they’re all worried AI will take off and they’ve missed that train.

        • altphoto@lemmy.today
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          6 months ago

          Both of which are probably training their own AI as middle men or stealing your search terms to tell Walmart what type of peanut butter you’re most likely to buy if they could lock it up on a plastic covered shelve.

          • Eyedust@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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            6 months ago

            Probably, but neither automatically opt into AI replies. Ecosia has an AI chat, but it doesn’t run until you go to it. Startpage has no AI option that I can see.

            Ecosia has the upside of planting trees depending on user search rate. Not sure how true that is, though. I prefer startpage either way. Startpage claims to be privacy first, and I’ve never received tailored results or ads.

            That doesn’t mean they don’t sell info. We can’t know that for sure, but it sure as hell beats using Google and it’s automatic AI searching.

    • medgremlin@midwest.social
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      6 months ago

      Firefox has a plugin that blocks the AI results. It works pretty well most of the time, but it occasionally has hiccups when Google updates stuff or something.

    • rdri@lemmy.world
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      6 months ago

      There is a way to “turn it off” with some search parameters. However there is no guarantee that the AI is not consuming resources at the backend.

      • merc@sh.itjust.works
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        6 months ago

        Also the search parameters are undocumented internal things that can change or be disabled at any time.

    • Getting6409@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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      6 months ago

      Piling on to the google alternatives heap: https://searx.space/

      You can pick a public instance of searxng and choose which engines it queries by going to the setting cog, then Engines. A few of these public instances I’ve checked out have only google enabled, though, so you really do need to check the settings.

      If you want to add a searxng instance as your default engine and your browser doesn’t automatically do it, the URL for that is: https://<searxng_url>/search?q=%s

      I have to add this manually for things like ironfox/firefox mobile.

  • johnyreeferseed@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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    6 months ago

    Meanwhile I’m down town I’m my city cleaning windows in office buildings that are 75% empty but the heat or ac is blasting on completely empty floors and most of the lights are on.

    • stoy@lemmy.zip
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      6 months ago

      The HVAC does serve a purpose, it reduces the moisture in the building, which would otherwise ruin the building

  • Pacattack57@lemmy.world
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    6 months ago

    When I’m told there’s power issues and to conserve power I drop my AC to 60 and leave all my lights on. Only way for them to fix the grid is to break it.

  • jsomae@lemmy.ml
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    6 months ago

    I know she’s exaggerating but this post yet again underscores how nobody understands that it is training AI which is computationally expensive. Deployment of an AI model is a comparable power draw to running a high-end videogame. How can people hope to fight back against things they don’t understand?

    • domdanial@reddthat.com
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      6 months ago

      I mean, continued use of AI encourages the training of new models. If nobody used the image generators, they wouldn’t keep trying to make better ones.

    • PeriodicallyPedantic@lemmy.ca
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      6 months ago

      Right, but that’s kind of like saying “I don’t kill babies” while you use a product made from murdered baby souls. Yes you weren’t the one who did it, but your continued use of it caused the babies too be killed.

      There is no ethical consumption under capitalism and all that, but I feel like here is a line were crossing. This fruit is hanging so low it’s brushing the grass.

      • jsomae@lemmy.ml
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        6 months ago

        Are you interpreting my statement as being in favour of training AIs?

        • PeriodicallyPedantic@lemmy.ca
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          6 months ago

          I’m interpreting your statement as “the damage is done so we might as well use it”
          And I’m saying that using it causes them to train more AIs, which causes more damage.

          • jsomae@lemmy.ml
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            6 months ago

            I agree with your second statement. You have misunderstood me. I am not saying the damage is done so we might as well use it. I am saying people don’t understand that it is the training of AIs which is directly power-draining.

            I don’t understand why you think that my observation people are ignorant about how AIs work is somehow an endorsement that we should use AIs.

            • PeriodicallyPedantic@lemmy.ca
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              6 months ago

              I guess.

              It still smells like an apologist argument to be like “yeah but using it doesn’t actually use a lot of power”.

              I’m actually not really sure I believe that argument either, through. I’m pretty sure that inference is hella expensive. When people talk about training, they don’t talk about the cost to train on a single input, they talk about the cost for the entire training. So why are we talking about the cost to infer on a single input?
              What’s the cost of running training, per hour? What’s the cost of inference, per hour, on a similarly sized inference farm, running at maximum capacity?

              • jsomae@lemmy.ml
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                6 months ago

                Maybe you should stop smelling text and try reading it instead. :P

                Running an LLM in deployment can be done locally on one’s machine, on a single GPU, and in this case is like playing a video game for under a minute. OpenAI models are larger than by a factor of 10 or more, so it’s maybe like playing a video game for 15 minutes (obviously varies based on the response to the query.)

                It makes sense to measure deployment usage marginally based on its queries for the same reason it makes sense to measure the environmental impact of a car in terms of hours or miles driven. There’s no natural way to do this for training though. You could divide training by the number of queries, to amortize it across its actual usage, which would make it seem significantly cheaper, but it comes with the unintuitive property that this amortization weight goes down as more queries are made, so it’s unclear exactly how much of the cost of training should be assigned to a given query. It might make more sense to talk in terms of expected number of total queries during the lifetime deployment of a model.

                • PeriodicallyPedantic@lemmy.ca
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                  6 months ago

                  You’re way overcomplicating how it could be done. The argument is that training takes more energy:

                  Typically if you have a single cost associated with a service, then you amortize that cost over the life of the service: so you take the total energy consumption of training and divide it by the total number of user-hours spent doing inference, and compare that to the cost of a single user running inference for an hour (which they can estimate by the number of user-hours in an hour divided by their global inference energy consumption for that hour).

                  If these are “apples to orange” comparisons, then why do people defending AI usage (and you) keep making the comparison?

                  But even if it was true that training is significantly more expensive that inference, or that they’re inherently incomparable, that doesn’t actually change the underlying observation that inference is still quite energy intensive, and the implicit value statement that the energy spent isn’t worth the affect on society

    • gandalf_der_12te@discuss.tchncs.de
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      6 months ago

      I feel like i’ve read a very similar argument somewhere recently, but i have difficulty remembering it precisely. It went something like this:

      • If a company kills 5 people, it was either an accident, an unfortunate mishap, a necessity of war (in case of the weapons industry) or some other bullshit excuse.
      • If the people threaten to kill 5 billionaires, they’re charged with “terrorism” (see Luigi Mangione’s case).
  • ViatorOmnium@piefed.social
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    6 months ago

    Two wrongs don’t make a right. And if your neighbour is dosing the neighbourhood with gasoline while wildfires are on the horizon, you smack him, you don’t go and get your own can.

    • decended_being@midwest.social
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      6 months ago

      Agreed, but this is like comparing your neighbor burning 1 million acres to you having a bonfire. The scale is the problem. We should absolutely take individual responsibility; however, our small impact is only felt when we band together.

      • doeknius_gloek@discuss.tchncs.de
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        6 months ago

        our small impact is only felt when we band together

        It is also offset immediately when unregulated corporations use the saved energy to sell us the next dumb thing.

        • plyth@feddit.org
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          6 months ago

          It is not offset. If you bend together you don’t buy the next dumb thing.

          Bending together is the only thing that can create change, billionaires won’t.

    • sabreW4K3@lazysoci.alOP
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      6 months ago

      Switch all traditional AC to being powered by Heat Pumps, destroy all private jets, ban recreational flights and power AI responsibly or not at all.

        • sabreW4K3@lazysoci.alOP
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          6 months ago

          In my attempt at brevity, I articulated myself wrong, totally my bad. I would like the old school systems replaced with either air source heat pumps or ground source heat pumps, backed up with on-site solar and batteries. Modern heat pump systems can heat and cool and are much more efficient than AC as generally installed.

          • gray@pawb.social
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            6 months ago

            An AC is an “air heat pump”. The only difference between an AC and what we call a “heat pump” is a reversing valve, which can send refrigerant the other way to heat the interior instead of cooling it.

            They’re literally the same thing.

            • sabreW4K3@lazysoci.alOP
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              6 months ago

              They’re literally the same thing.

              A traditional air conditioner provides only cooling by moving heat out of your home, primarily contributing to summer electricity peaks. In contrast, a heat pump offers both heating and cooling by simply reversing the refrigerant flow, making it a more versatile and energy-efficient solution for year-round comfort. While heat pumps increase overall electricity demand by electrifying heating, they also shift energy consumption patterns, creating a new winter peak for the grid to manage. However, this increased electrical load presents an opportunity for demand response, allowing smart heat pumps to adjust usage during peak times to balance the grid. Ultimately, widespread heat pump adoption, powered by a decarbonising electricity supply, is crucial for reducing fossil fuel reliance and achieving a greener energy system, albeit requiring significant grid infrastructure upgrades.

      • Laser@feddit.org
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        6 months ago

        ban recreational flights

        No. Either ban all flights (excluding medical) or none. Otherwise, it will be something only available to those gambling the system.

            • sabreW4K3@lazysoci.alOP
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              6 months ago

              If your meeting requires you to go to the Bahamas, so be it. But there are doctors and nurses that have been travelling around the world, educators that travel, carers, archeologists. Yes, some will attempt to game the system, but there’s a lot of good people doing vital work that need to travel.

              • zalgotext@sh.itjust.works
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                6 months ago

                Man, this is one I’ve tried to wrestle with multiple times. I feel like there are monumental benefits to trans-Atlantic/trans-Pacific recreational flights (really just most long international flights). Banning those would almost certainly increase feelings of isolation, and probably make the already-rampant xenophobia plaguing the world even worse. There really aren’t viable alternatives to flying for getting across a multi-thousand-mile-wide ocean - boats are too slow for the average person, and building trains over the ocean is impractical. Maybe the focus should be on making planes more environmentally friendly, instead of outright banning them?

                • sabreW4K3@lazysoci.alOP
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                  6 months ago

                  The thing is tourism does more damage than good, hence saying frig recreational flights. If people are determined to travel, make them sign up to educational holidays.

    • doeknius_gloek@discuss.tchncs.de
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      6 months ago

      Great, now this might work with my neighbor, but how exactly do I smack mega corps and the state? Are we talking eco terrorism here or do you have some other idea that hasn’t been tried in the last decades?

      I mean, climate change isn’t new but humanity still fucks up the planet and that does not seem to change. Why should we have to sweat at home while professionalized greed burns down everything around us? I will gladly take individual responsibility, but not alone.

      Actually, a failing power grid here and there might act as a wake-up call and then we can start talking about solutions, not just symptomatic treatment.

      • jjjalljs@ttrpg.network
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        6 months ago

        Talking about direct action or even a mildly disruptive protest will probably get you moderated here, and in trouble in real life. It feels like the only options “allowed” are stern words. At least a progressive like Zohran won the primary in NYC, but we’ll need a lot more of that to make a difference.

        On the other hand, Luigi is considered by many a hero.

  • Dr. Moose@lemmy.world
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    6 months ago

    1 prompt is avg 1Wh of electricity -> typical AC runs avg 1,500 W = 2.4 seconds of AC per prompt.

    Energy capacity is really not a problem first world countries should face. We have this solved and you’re just taking the bait of blaming normal dudes using miniscule amounts of power while billionaires fly private jets for afternoon getaways.

    • f314@lemmy.world
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      6 months ago

      They are blaming the billionaires (or their companies), for making the thing nobody wanted so they can make money off of it. The guy making a five-breasted woman is a side effect.

      And sure, that one image only uses a moderate amount of power. But there still exists giant data centers for only this purpose, gobbling up tons of power and evaporating tons of water for power and cooling. And all this before considering the training of the models (which you better believe they’re doing continuously to try to come up with better ones).

      • Dr. Moose@lemmy.world
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        6 months ago

        nobody wanted according to whom? It’s literally the most used product of this century stop deluding yourself.

        All datacenters in the world combined use like 5% of our energy now and the value we get from computing far outweighs any spending we have here. You’re better off not buying more trash from Temu rather than complain about software using electricity. This is ridiculous.

        • bridgeenjoyer@sh.itjust.works
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          Where are you getting your false information. Its certainly not the most used. And, the reason it’s used at all is from advertising and ownership of the media by the billionaire class to shove the gibbity in our faces at every waking moment so people use it. They’re losing money like never before on ai.

          • Dr. Moose@lemmy.world
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            This level of collective delusion is crazy. I don’t think any amount of stats will change your mind so you’re clearly argueing in bad faith but sure:

            https://explodingtopics.com/blog/chatgpt-users says 5.2B monthly visits compared to Facebook 12.7 and Instagram’s 7.5. Chatgpt is literally bigger than X.com already. Thats just one tool and LLM’s have direct integrations in phones and other apps.

            I really don’t understand what’s the point of purposefully lying here? We can all hate billionaires together without the need for this weird anti-intellectual bullshit.

            • bridgeenjoyer@sh.itjust.works
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              6 months ago

              I don’t agree that it’s the most used invention this century. Also, typing “hi there gibbity” hardly counts as actually using the tool. If thats what you mean though, sure.

        • weststadtgesicht@discuss.tchncs.de
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          6 months ago

          People hate AI so much (for many good reasons!) that they can’t see or accept the truth: many many people want to use it, not just “billionaires”

    • InternetCitizen2@lemmy.world
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      A lot of things are solved, but capitalism means that we need a profit motive to act. World hunger is another good example. We know how to make fertilizer and how to genetically alter crops to ensure we never have a crop failure. We have trains and refrigeration to take food anywhere we want. Pretty much any box that we need to check to solve this problem has been. The places that have food problems largely have to do with poverty, which at this point is a polite way to say “I won’t make money, so I am okay with them starving”

      • Dr. Moose@lemmy.world
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        6 months ago

        Im not sure what’s the point here? If we dont like LLMs and data centers using power then we use existing strategies that work like taxing their power use and subsidizing household power use which btw we’re already doing almost everywhere around the world in some form or another.

        The data centers are actually easier to negotiate and work with than something like factories or households where energy margins are much more brittle. Datacenter employs like 5 people and you can squeeze with policy to match social expectations - you can’t do that with factories or households. So datacenter energy problem is not that difficult relatively speaking.

        • InternetCitizen2@lemmy.world
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          I am agreeing with you that the solutions exist, but the will to implement them is going to be the hard part. A big dampener is simply going to be the profit motive. There is more money in siding with the data center than a the households. Are households okay with an increasing in price? Data center is likely to manage that better, or even just pay a bribe to someone. I used food as another example of a problem that is solved. We can grow food without fail and build the rail to get it to where it needs. We just don’t because need does not match profit expectation. There are talks of building nuclear power for some data centers, but such talk would not happen for normal households.

          • Dr. Moose@lemmy.world
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            People definitely underestimate how cooperative big tech is relative to every other business mostly because big tech has a lot of money and very few expenses so friction is relatively a bigger bottle neck than almost any other industry. So I still think that pressuring openAi into green energy is easier than pressuring Volvo (or any manufacturer) which already is really brittle and has huge negotiation leverage in the form of jobs it provides.

            Take a look at any other business niche and no one’s comitting to green energy other than big tech. As you said yourself no other niche want to build their own nuclear reactors to satisfy their own green energy need.

            I think its OK to hate on big tech because they’re billionaires but people really lose sight here and complain about wrong things that distract from real much bigger issues and paints the entire movement as idiots.

    • salmoura@lemmy.eco.br
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      6 months ago

      A 12000 BTUs inverter split system at peak capacity requires less than 1500 W to run. After it reaches equilibrium it drops the power requirement significantly.

  • sunbrrnslapper@lemmy.world
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    6 months ago

    I have a crazy theory that requests like these will actually push people to care more about and take action on global warming.

        • theangryseal@lemmy.world
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          6 months ago

          I should have figured the Rick and Morty episode was a reference to something.

          Makes me think about South Park and watching it as it aired when I was a kid. There were so many things I missed because I hadn’t seen any of the source material for a lot of the jokes.

          Watching it all again 25 years later and damn, even better the second time around when you’ve seen all the shit they’re parodying.

          • SerotoninSwells@lemmy.world
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            I didn’t know Rick and Morty referenced this but I shouldn’t be surprised. Same here with the missed references. It makes rewatching older content not just nostalgic but also a fun discovery.

      • TriflingToad@sh.itjust.works
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        It’s from https://perchance.org/welcome and is super cool because it’s like half a soul-less AI and half a super cool tool that gets people into programming and they actually care about the Internet because they encourage people to learn how to code their own ais and have fun with it and I would absolutely have DEVOURED it when I was 13 on Tumblr (I forgot my ADHD meds today sorry if I’m rambling)